Avatar by James Cameron

[Tigersoap]

I did not intend to keep posting things about Avatar but as I was browsing through books at a local store I could not help but check out a book about the world of avatar.
Two things struck me, the Na'vi were linked to the neolithic era and the dance ritual in the movie was linked specifically to the use of peyotl in a glossary at the end of the book.

So I just started to look for the origin of the ideas behind the Na'vi themselves and stumbled upon this :

Question : What about the sex appeal aspect of it? Was the sexiness something James Cameron emphasized with you?
Answer : Well, he wanted them to be very beautiful. And I do believe that, at some point, he said something to the effect of...the audience has to want to f*** her. I mean, Jim is very plain in his language.

So, I went, "All right?" So I made something that, I don't know if I really particularly wanted to -flick- it, but it was certainly a beautiful alien. He definitely, he wanted it — because he really prefers women that are kind of athletic, and buff and stuff like that, so I, you know, designed something with big hands and feet, a big presence that felt really big and strong.

from : _http://io9.com/5354315/avatar-concept-designer-reveals-the-secrets-of-the-navi

But then, on the absolute other side of the coin is Playboy’s interview with Cameron, which delves into the hotness of the movie’s female stars. And breasts. When asked whether he designed Neytiri specifically to appeal to guys, Cameron replies, “And they won’t be able to control themselves.” (I guess that means yes.) A lot of that appeal, according to Cameron, started with the decision to give the character breasts — even though the Na’vi aren’t mammals.

from:_http://blogs.howstuffworks.com/2009/12/17/is-james-camerons-avatar-sexist/


I have also linked two articles who are interesting because they analyze the movie in a different angle than juts the obvious imho.

Whether Avatar is racist is a matter for debate. Regardless of where you come down on that question, it's undeniable that the film - like alien apartheid flick District 9, released earlier this year - is emphatically a fantasy about race. Specifically, it's a fantasy about race told from the point of view of white people. Avatar and scifi films like it give us the opportunity to answer the question: What do white people fantasize about when they fantasize about racial identity?

from : _http://io9.com/5422666/when-will-white-people-stop-making-movies-like-avatar

It is, at the basic level, a re-imagining of the great genocide against people of color on America’s original colonial backdrop. And the ethereal, blue-skinned Na’vi, with their painted faces and feathered arrows, are the ideal representations of the systematic oppression that has been lobbed at various incantations of the “savage” that came before. But unlike “Dances with Wolves,” which ultimately asserts the superiority of the way of the native, “Avatar” doesn’t even attempt to hide it’s double-standard. Jake makes his last stand as the Great White Hope with the assistance of a wild bird and a sub-machine gun, effectively turning the narrative of the native into the narrative of the white savior.

from _http://globalshift.org/2009/12/dances-with-discrimination-on-avatar-racism-misogyny-and-disabled-prejudice/

Follow the many links from the article itself, many things to ponder.

fyi

 

[spyraal]

I watched the movie in 3D. It was quite an interesting experience for me to watch a stereoscopic movie, but still IMO Avatar is featuring too many mainstream stereotypes to live up to my high expectations...
I admit i was expecting something more "revolutionary" also in terms of script rather than just visuals. Maybe a more accurate description of the STO-STS dynamics...
What do i mean?
The Na'vi are "connected" and "wise" yet they seem to have no forewarning of what awaits them, and no protection from their knowledge.
That, for example, reduces their Sacred Tree (a glorious self-illuminated tree where the wisdom and spirits of their ancestors lived and talked to them) to a mere decoration.
Then it all comes to a "bow vs. machine gun" fight since the director gives the Na'vi no other "higher" or spiritual means to overcome the physical high-tech attack of humans.

It would be so much more interesting IMO having the Na'vi possessing the Being and Knowledge so as to be able to defend themselves from a higher level of reality than humans,
thus rendering their technology useless etc., or something like that. Hmmm...

Anyway, it seems Avatar was good but not good enough for me to avoid making my own movie sometime in the future... ;D
Still i highly suggest watch it!

:)

 

[FASTWALKER]

I ran across this. My ears are not "trained" to hear all the reversing but I thought it was interesting just the same. I did like the movie in 3D and had to brush away embers and pollen from the front of my face a couple of times during the movie. I feel that those who thought the plot was lacking failed to see the deeper meanings in the movie.
There are some other interesting information on this site....
_http://www.evpreversespeaking.com/2009/12/23/avatar-reversed/

 

[Vulcan59]

Hi Fastwalker,

Have you had a chance to read this topic about reverse speech? :)

 

[FASTWALKER]

Hi Vulcan,
I have not seen that link before. Thanks for the link. I try to stay open to different material as I am very inquisitive. I don't think RS is the Holy Grail but I do feel there is something to this. I find it curious that the best RS comes from a certain brand of recorder- A Panasonic RR DR60 and that people who use this particular model of recorder get the same messages in different parts of the world. There are also some protocols to follow when doing this type of work and you become grooved as it were when doing it on a regular basis. Sounds kind of like using a Spirit Board which is used on a regular basis following specific protocols and with great effort one becomes grooved.
It is interesting to me that David Oats was being harassed by TPTB when using RS on politicians. He was warned with a phone call and the next day his house was burnt down. So, I must conclude that there might be something to this.
There is a pdf book that gives some more information if you would care to do a little more research. I found it of general interest and a short read.
_http://evpreversespeaking.com/files/reversed.pdf

Regards,
Fastwalker

 

[Cyre2067]

I haven't seen the movie yet but I am troubled by the raving reviews in a sense.

Well, for what it's worth, I've had the same thoughts. The fervor of the reviews is a bit disconcerting. It's a movie.

I also experienced the latest visual 3D movie technology when seeing 'Up' and it really unsettled me. I've never dissociated that quickly - or in a way that seemed totally against my will. Quite frankly, I felt as though there was a LOT of information going into my mind that I was not consciously aware of and I didn't like it at all I don't intend to ever watch a 3D movie again with that technology; it seemed like opening my mind wide open to whatever was transmitted on any level.

I'll probably check out the movie when it hits DVD, so hopefully it will be enjoyable. :)

Hmm I hadn't thought about that. Though honestly the movie did kinda 'nail' me emotionally speaking. There's several times where I actually felt like the character in question and was moved by the feelings he/she was having. I cried more then once, and the first time i left the theater all my friends we're just kinda ready to get back to life and I needed to go home to contemplate/be alone.

It was the first digital 3D movie I've seen. Didn't really bother me, no nausea or headache or anything, there were a couple of scenes that erked me visually due to how they were framed, but overall I really enjoyed the experience.

I watched the movie in 3D. It was quite an interesting experience for me to watch a stereoscopic movie, but still IMO Avatar is featuring too many mainstream stereotypes to live up to my high expectations...

Heh well yeah, an accurate description of STS-STO dynamics in a mainstream film is asking a bit much imho. However, I do think several of the principles were illuminated fairly well between the way the humans and Na'vi lived.

-SPOILER-


I also tend to see the movie being about personal transformation, and don't really understand the whole 'great white savior' bit. In point of fact Jake goes on to become a Na'vi in body as well as mind, so the fact that he started out as a white marine really was unimportant imho.

 

[shijing]

Hmm I hadn't thought about that. Though honestly the movie did kinda 'nail' me emotionally speaking. There's several times where I actually felt like the character in question and was moved by the feelings he/she was having. I cried more then once, and the first time i left the theater all my friends we're just kinda ready to get back to life and I needed to go home to contemplate/be alone.

It was the first digital 3D movie I've seen. Didn't really bother me, no nausea or headache or anything, there were a couple of scenes that erked me visually due to how they were framed, but overall I really enjoyed the experience.

I saw this on Christmas Eve, and I had a similar reaction. It was very emotional in places, but I feel like it did a really good job of presenting the reality of imperialism as well as contrasting characters with a strong conscience with those without any obvious signs of empathy. The interconnection-of-life theme was very in-your-face, which bothered me at first because of its lack of subtlety (requiring a specific biological explanation and so forth), but it occurred to me that this approach might be necessary to hammer the point home with some viewers who just wouldn't get it otherwise.

I did OK with the 3D too -- I was a bit apprehensive about it after anart described her experience with Up, but as far as I can tell I didn't have obvious dissociation issues. This could be different according to individual though.

 

[Nathan]

I hadn't actually planned on seeing this (the trailer looked pretty bad, despite the jaw-dropping visuals), but ended up seeing it the other day in 3D. I have to say that I quite enjoyed it. The unobtanium (yes, it's actually called unobtanium) made me think instantly of Iraqi oil and it's probably a good thing that this was so blatantly in your face as it seems to have left a general feeling of discontent with "the way we do things" among people I know.

The visuals are lovely and the world and its inhabitants are wonderfully designed right down to the tiniest of details. I found the 3D to be fine on the eyes, which surprised me. Although before the movie started we were treated to a trailer of Alice of Wonderland and the 3D in this was downright assaulting! But the depth of field in Avatar was better and I think if you compressed the depth just a bit more, even a fast-paced thriller like a Bourne movie would be very watchable in 3D.

Avatar did slouch in some areas though. The main character was disturbingly bland, unlike his Avatar, who seemed unintentionally to be a completely different person. The plot is pretty basic, yet quite moving in parts. But if you're one of those people who loves to try to guess what happens next, don't! You'll end up working out the entire story before you're even 10 minutes in. Better to sit back and enjoy what Avatar excels in: the visuals. I think Avatar has some weaknesses and some strengths, but in 3D the strengths overwhelm the weaknesses. If you watch this in 2D you might fall asleep, but in 3D it's pretty entertaining. I'd recommend this movie for the 3D experience alone.

 

[anart]

I did OK with the 3D too -- I was a bit apprehensive about it after anart described her experience with Up, but as far as I can tell I didn't have obvious dissociation issues. This could be different according to individual though.

Just for clarification, what I meant by 'dissociation' is the type of dissociation that occurs when one watches a movie and loses track of the fact that they're sitting in a theatre with hundreds of other people. What was striking to me about the 3D technology is how quickly that happened after placing the glasses on - it was almost instantaneous. I don't watch much TV at all or go to the movies very often at all (though I watch movies on dvd pretty regularly) - so it's possible I was hypersensitive to that effect - not experiencing it very often - and the 3D technology heightened it even further. The difference in the way my mind was working was startling with those glasses on - the experiential 'melding with' the movie was VERY easy to do - in other words, dissociation. Hopefully that clarifies what I was trying to get at.

 

[Ca.]

I thinks whats interesting is his Fathers association to MK Ultra and the fact that there was talk that Cameron was 33° Mason. Would the devil be in the details of this and all his movies they all seem to possesses some sort of disclosure or conditioning ?

 

[shijing]

I did OK with the 3D too -- I was a bit apprehensive about it after anart described her experience with Up, but as far as I can tell I didn't have obvious dissociation issues. This could be different according to individual though.

Just for clarification, what I meant by 'dissociation' is the type of dissociation that occurs when one watches a movie and loses track of the fact that they're sitting in a theatre with hundreds of other people. What was striking to me about the 3D technology is how quickly that happened after placing the glasses on - it was almost instantaneous. I don't watch much TV at all or go to the movies very often at all (though I watch movies on dvd pretty regularly) - so it's possible I was hypersensitive to that effect - not experiencing it very often - and the 3D technology heightened it even further. The difference in the way my mind was working was startling with those glasses on - the experiential 'melding with' the movie was VERY easy to do - in other words, dissociation. Hopefully that clarifies what I was trying to get at.

Sure -- that's actually what I thought you meant. It being a possibility, I was just relieved that I didn't disassociate that much (any more than I usually would, in any case) since I think I would be as uncomfortable as you described if it happened that quickly and thoroughly. I don't think I would want to do it again in that case either.

 

[herondancer]

I thinks whats interesting is his Fathers association to MK Ultra and the fact that there was talk that Cameron was 33° Mason. Would the devil be in the details of this and all his movies they all seem to possesses some sort of disclosure or conditioning ?

Hi M.A.O.

Could you provide some documenation regarding James Cameron's father and MK-Ultra? It would make a good addition to the research data base.

Thanks,

Herondancer

 

[Tigersoap]

Could you provide some documenation regarding James Cameron's father and MK-Ultra? It would make a good addition to the research data base.

Hi herondancer,

Donald Ewen Cameron is quoted in many websites as the father of James Cameron

Donald Ewen Cameron (1901-1967) was a Scottish-American psychiatrist. Born in Bridge of Allan, he graduated from the University of Glasgow in 1924.
Cameron lived and worked in Albany, New York, and was involved in experiments in Canada for Project MKULTRA, a United States based CIA-directed mind control program which eventually led to the publication of the KUBARK Counterintelligence Interrogation manual. He is unrelated to another CIA psychiatrist, Dr. Alan Cameron, who helped pioneer psychological profiling of world leaders during the 1970s.

from : _http://www.viswiki.com/en/Donald_Ewen_Cameron

There is this article but it is certainly full of disinformation :

_http://www.whale.to/b/cameron5.html


but the official bio of James Cameron says that Phillip Cameron, an electrical engineer was his father not Ewen Cameron.

_http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Cameron


FYI.

Edit : changed "and" by "not"

 

[Beau]

Could you provide some documenation regarding James Cameron's father and MK-Ultra? It would make a good addition to the research data base.

Hi herondancer,

Donald Ewen Cameron is quoted in many websites as the father of James Cameron

I'm not sure that's the case. His bios online all list him as the son of an engineer, Phillip, not as Ewen Cameron's son. Not sure where M.A.O. got his information that James' father is associated with MK Ultra.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000116/bio
http://www.filmreference.com/film/71/James-Cameron.html

 

[Turgon]

I haven't seen the movie yet but I am troubled by the raving reviews in a sense.

Well, for what it's worth, I've had the same thoughts. The fervor of the reviews is a bit disconcerting. It's a movie.

I also experienced the latest visual 3D movie technology when seeing 'Up' and it really unsettled me. I've never dissociated that quickly - or in a way that seemed totally against my will. Quite frankly, I felt as though there was a LOT of information going into my mind that I was not consciously aware of and I didn't like it at all I don't intend to ever watch a 3D movie again with that technology; it seemed like opening my mind wide open to whatever was transmitted on any level.

I'll probably check out the movie when it hits DVD, so hopefully it will be enjoyable. :)

I actually reflected back a bit on how 'into' Avatar I had become (I saw it twice in one week) but have to admit that after discussing the movie with a few people, not very many people saw, or really took to some of the messages and symbolisms in the movie the way I did. I could see the potential STO principles and the examples of pathological thinking, in the case of the Major and Corporate Exec, but just about everyone I talked to about it kept referring to the movie as if it was some type of dream. Like they left reality for a little while. It seemed as if everyone was too busy enjoying the 3D imagery, which I liked too, but didn't really focus on key messages that has been talked about on this thread.

Just an observation, fwiw...