Putin Recognizes Donbass Republics, Sends Russian Military to 'Denazify' Ukraine

Ok, now the suggestion's been made that Wagner fighters go to Belarus.

What does Putin mean by this? That those loyal to Prigozhin may go regroup with him?
They can do whatever they want there in exile and under Luka's close watch. Every one of their names will be catalogued. But they won't be part of Wagner anymore. Prig is going to jail, sooner or later. A new "Wagner" will be easily formed from the Russian soldiers that have gained experience in Ukraine over the last 18 months.
 
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In what universe did he think he was going to take over Russia or get Putin to fire the top brass in the MoD? I get that he's crazy, but is he dumb? He'd also have to be the latter to think he could do what he did successfully?

It's hard to believe he's dumb given the successes he's had so I have to think that he's over ambitious to the point of being delusional. Still, the fact he's kind of not been arrested makes me think he either had so much good will to use up or as Joe said, he's a very good actor and is being used to test who is loyal to the government and who is not.
 
hey can do whatever they want there in exile and under Luka's close watch.
Exile? I will just remind for those who are not very familiar with the geography of Russia:
The distance from Rostov (where Prigozhin started) to Moscow is more than 1000 km. + 200 km or 300 km from Wagner base camps in the LPR and DPR to Rostov. 1200km-1300km in total.
The new Wagner camps in Belarus (according to the media in the Mogilev region) will be at a distance of 600 km from Moscow, i.e. twice as close as they were before.
In addition, there is actually no state border between Belarus and the Russian Federation, you can freely move back and forth.

Prig is going to jail, sooner or later.
He had already been in prison for many years. There is nothing new for him there. In addition, he is a hero of Russia (medals and orders), awarded by Putin, and is also very respected by ordinary people. Putting him in jail is Putin's worst dream.

or as Joe said, he's a very good actor and is being used to test who is loyal to the government and who is not
Loyalty in Russia is an empty phrase. A lot of people (bloggers, journalists, politicians and others) "changed their shoes in the air" several times in one day and showed their vile and two-faced nature. Wagner's march on Moscow showed that there are a lot of problems in the government itself: for the most part, it is corrupt, cowardly, deceitful and vicious. And sometimes it’s just stupid, what are the idiots who dug up the asphalt on federal highways with excavators in the hope of stopping the tanks.
For my part, I sincerely hope that there was some hidden meaning in this whole adventure of Prigozhin, which we have not yet understood.
 
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Absolute disaster. Made Russia look like a 3rd world country.

Not only your sentiment and it’s actually one of many sides of Russia:

Oleg Tsarev, in a justifiably gloomy mood when the march was still on, posted:

... When, after perestroika, they broke the Union, they said that we would live like under capitalism. People drew an example in the form of Germany and the United States. Only a few said that in most capitalist countries life is like in Africa and Latin America. And having collapsed the Union, we will live as third world countries. Nobody listened to them.

That is how we live. Inequality. Corruption. Now added - a military coup. Why are you surprised? Common in Africa and Latin America. Now in Russia...


A translation from @DDgeopolitics of the latest comment from Ramzan Kadyrov. It is revealing to hear his experience and confirms other observations about Prigozhin.
Let’s remember that Ramzan Kadyrov was literarily bred by Russia for his current position since he was very young; he is strongly entangled in top officials’ web; and, as Chechen, he is by nature very, very loyal. For that reason, I’d think that what he publicly said was not necessarily true, or at least it was not the whole truth. It was just needed.

Russia, over the decade, became the master of "maskirovka" (military deception)

Bingo.

(Disclaimer: I know that what follows is not a popular view and may be wrong, but may still be worth to be voiced.)

People can say many various things about Prigozhin but he is neither stupid nor naïve. He couldn't think for a second that he would be able to enter Moscow with his convoys nor that Putin would give in to his demands under pressure of 1000 armored vehicles approaching the capital. So either he was used as a tool by some siloviki clan planning a real coup (with Western blessing perhaps) or... he did it with pre-knowledge and approval from Putin (to give Putin a pretext to drain the swamps, for example, or for another reason).

Given how much of free pass he was given, I'd bet on the latter. He was let to freely enter Rostov (a city twice the size of Brussels and a with a big military hub!), his convoy was let to make 800 km toward Moscow with laughable preventive measures. And suddenly Lukashenko saves Russia from another 1825- or 1993-like revolt? Seriously? And what if Prigozhin would have not agreed? Went crazy and ballistic? Massacre on both sides? Who would take responsibility for THAT high risk? Why wasn't he arrested long ago? For badmouthing the Army for example. Or for "tax fraud"? It doesn't make sense. Not to me, at least. So I've been thinking about why's and for-what's...

It turns out, I was not alone. Just came across the following article, and like its author, I consider it a working hypothesis until facts prove otherwise. Also, I think these coming weeks and months may see some shifting within the power circles, so it may be smart to keep a close eye on whatever becomes public. For example: Strangely, and perhaps not accidentally, the Governor of the Tula region, Alexei Dumin was credited for the Lukashenko negotiation success by various media outlets and TG commenters for many hours until his press office denied his participation.


Putin and Prigozhin: 30 years of a durable bond

The 'St. Petersburg group' has been the most powerful force in the Kremlin since 2000. Prigozhin and Putin share that bond, friendly since the mid 1990s. Think of Wagner as Putin's praetorian guard.

The tumult in Russia this weekend generated much hysteria and confusion. Western journalists, writing far from the events, published the usual nonsense, promoting the idea that President Putin is losing power and Russia will descend into civil war. But even pro-Russian analysts indulged in reckless speculation. Scott Ritter falsely claimed that Yevgeny Prigozhin, the Wagner group owner, is a NATO agent.

On the surface, this ‘mutiny’ was a conflict between Prigozhin and Defense Minister Sergei Shoigu. In fact, Prigozhin called it “the March of Justice”. Tensions between the two men have simmered for months, with Prigozhin often berating Shoigu and his generals on social media. Such outrageous behavior is unheard of and indicates that Prigozhin enjoys patronage that exceeds Shoigu. That can only mean one person.

Prigozhin acts confidently because he is a member of Putin’s inner circle. I doubt that this ‘mutiny’ was spontaneous, allegedly instigated by a Russian army missile attack against Wagner troops. I suspect that Prigozhin was acting according to a plan with the tacit or even active involvement of Putin. But towards what goal?

Wagner is the world’s most effective private military, serving nearly a decade as Putin’s praetorian guard — a highly loyal force that the President counts on to project Russian power abroad, and turn the tide on the battlefield against NATO/Ukrainian invaders in besieged Donbass.

If Prigozhin didn’t have such close relations with Putin, he’d have been jailed long ago. Remember: Russian law doesn’t even allow private military groups. Technically, Wagner shouldn’t exist. But it does, and the answer to “How” is quite obvious.

So, what happened this weekend in Rostov, which is home to the Southern Military District? Based on available information I conclude that Prigozhin carried out an important task for Putin. But what exactly?

Perhaps the task was to weed out a corrupt and disloyal fifth column in the government and military. In fact, in a recent public meeting Putin referred to incompetent generals, hinting that their days are numbered.

Or perhaps the ‘mutiny’ this weekend was an attempt to conduct confusing troop movements. The biggest problem Russia faces is NATO’s powerful surveillance capabilities. The enemy is aware of nearly every movement by the Russian military.

Also, this morning there are reports that Wagner is building a huge base in Belarus. Perhaps Wagner’s deployment to Belarus is an attempt to stop NATO efforts to overthrow President Alexander Lukashenko. Either way, NATO is panicking.

Oddly enough, Wagner continues to aggressively recruit new soldiers. The ‘mutiny’ has stimulated more Russian men to protect their Motherland. What a strange ‘mutiny’! The mutineers are allowed to grow even more powerful.

I don’t want to speculate any more about this ‘mutiny’ because events are still developing. Instead, I’d like to focus on important facts that have been forgotten or ignored, but which are vital in order to understand the context of this weekend’s events. Then, you can make your own conclusion.

1. Putin and Prigozhin have known each other at least since the mid 1990s. Both were born and raised in Leningrad (St. Petersburg). The locals share a special bond because of the city’s grandeur and eventful history. However, despite the city’s reputation as a cultural capital with a world-class intelligentsia, it’s also an industrial center with a sizable working-class. Privileged or not, all residents of Leningrad/St. Petersburg share a fierce love for their city and are raised with traditions and values that you won’t find anywhere else in Russia or the world.

2. While their young lives had different trajectories, both Putin and Prigozhin were molded by Leningrad’s rough post-War street culture where loyalty and one’s word of honor were vital to remain alive and thrive. How these men behave today is based on a shared understanding of strength, honor, respect and justice. If a man breaks his word and compromises his honor, then he’s finished. These concepts are entirely foreign to the western mind, with its obsession on legal contracts, NDAs and strict bureaucratic procedures.

3. Eventually, Putin went to work at the KGB and was stationed in Germany. The young Prigozhin went into crime and spent most of the 1980s in prison for theft. They operated in the same world, but on different sides of the barricade. In the 1990s, Prigozhin became a successful businessman. In 1995, he opened the city's first upscale restaurant, Staraya Tamozhnya, where the local elite dined. Putin became Mayor Anatoly Sobchak’s deputy in charge of external relations, handling visits of foreign dignitaries and businessmen. When you wanted to impress your foreign guests, you took them to Prigozhin’s Staraya Tamozhnya.

4. In the late 1990s, Prigozhin founded Concord Catering, which handled all the high-level state and private banquets in St. Petersburg. (I sometimes attended these). Again, Prigozhin rubbed shoulders with the city’s most powerful people, many of whom soon joined Putin in Moscow and became Russia’s new elite, the so-called “St. Petersburg group”. Prigozhin has been close to the Russian power elite for about 25 to 30 years. If you’re in the “St. Petersburg group”, then you’re the elite of the elite. This is a brotherhood of sorts, with common forged experiences from childhood through the wild 1990s and beyond.

5. When Putin became president on Dec 31, 1999, he quickly gathered his loyalists from St. Petersburg. In early 2000, I interviewed one of those loyalists, Vladimir Kozhin. He told me: “The president has many things to do in a short period of time, and it’s crucial for him to know that he has people he can count on and trust.” And so, St. Petersburg-born Prigozhin eventually became Putin’s fixer of sorts, the go-to-guy in tough situations at home and abroad.

6. Fast forward to 2014, when Prigozhin founded the Wagner private military group. Russian law does not allow for such groups, yet somehow Prigozhin was able to create the company. Since then, Wagner has led the most sensitive military operations for the Kremlin, especially in Syria and in Africa. The goal — to project Russian power abroad for the first time since the collapse of the USSR. Wagner has been a key asset, working in the Central African Republic, Libya, Mali, Sudan, etc. This means that Prigozhin has a direct line to the Kremlin.

7. Wagner soldiers are very patriotic. Many are vets with close ties to comrades in the regular army. Wagner’s victory in Bakhmut is Russia’s most significant victory in this war. Wagner pinned down and destroyed vast amounts of NATO/ Ukrainian resources. Do you think war heroes would mutiny against Putin, their Commander-in-Chief? Wagner troops command immense respect among the Russian people. This weekend, journalist Alina Lipp was in Rostov and she spoke with the Wagner troops, saying they were very friendly and not at all aggressive.

8. Finally, Prigozhin is a master of media manipulation who loves to troll and mess with the minds of the West. One is never sure when he’s telling the truth, or being sarcastic and simply mocking his opponents. In March, when a Wall Street Journal employee was arrested on charges of spying, Prigozhin commented: “I’ll check my torture chambers to see he’s there.” Prigozhin has a PR and media management company that was accused of interfering in U.S. elections by weaponizing social media. Such an operation must have had tacit approval from the President.

If Prigozhin truly was a threat to the President, then he’d have been arrested months ago, and he wouldn’t have left Rostov a free man in the wake of very odd negotiations that led to a quick resolution of the ‘mutiny’, allowing him and the Wagner army to find ‘refuge’ in allied Belarus.

What really happened this weekend might become fully evident in the coming weeks, or perhaps never. But as we can see from the above, Prigozhin has long been deeply embedded in Putin’s inner circle and has conducted highly sensitive operations for the Kremlin.

Until new information appears that might refute what I’m saying, I’ll go with the idea that this weekend Prigozhin acted in the interests of Russia on behalf of his old friend from St. Petersburg.
 
But even I don't buy it. I think "sometimes a cigar is just a cigar" applies here. Prigozhin is a blow hard with delusions of grandeur, and a liar. He was, however, outsmarted by Putin, who I think now enjoys increased popularity among both the Russian military and population.

I keep thinking someone or something nurtured his ego to the point where he could have believed he was more popular and/or deserving than Shoigu. And that time was ripe for people to stand behind him against the MoD and military commanders would follow him to Moscow. Completely deluded and removed from reality.

On another note, in the Discord Leaks we find this, and given the events could be not that far off?

Prigozhin said that if Ukraine’s commanders withdrew their soldiers from the area around Bakhmut, he would give Kyiv information on Russian troop positions, which Ukraine could use to attack them. Prigozhin conveyed the proposal to his contacts in Ukraine’s military intelligence directorate, with whom he has maintained secret communications during the course of the war, according to previously unreported U.S. intelligence documents leaked on the group-chat platform Discord.
 
In what universe did he think he was going to take over Russia or get Putin to fire the top brass in the MoD? I get that he's crazy, but is he dumb? He'd also have to be the latter to think he could do what he did successfully?

It's hard to believe he's dumb given the successes he's had so I have to think that he's over ambitious to the point of being delusional. Still, the fact he's kind of not been arrested makes me think he either had so much good will to use up or as Joe said, he's a very good actor and is being used to test who is loyal to the government and who is not.

I put it in quotes because it is a bit long:

As I see it in the absence of more information and what Lukachenko says, I think that one thing led to another and there was a war of powers, simply Prigozhin with all his defects and ideas was deeply corralled and reacted in a way they were not expecting, this cornering him would have been done on purpose since he was one of the most visible types who in turn was speaking very badly of the high command which is risky for morale and the stability of everything...
yes to this we add that in general despite there being support for Putin, the people are at the same time somewhat impatient for the proceeding of the war perceived as unnecessarily slow and as everywhere, there is resentment and distrust towards part of the elite, especially especially if she is wealthy and accusations of corruption abound, for all this is that they would have decided to surround Wagner...

Prigozhin for his part, would be a patriot, but that is not mutually exclusive with the fact that he is unbalanced in other areas and that he does not have Complaints or be reactionary, it has already sounded a lot around here, but Kadirov despite saying that he trusts Putin and that he has access to details that others ignore, also at the time expressed his discontent for feeling that they were laughing at his country and called to escalate the war through the use of tactical nuclear weapons, he was criticized for this by the high command, but this event serves as an example of the mood of impatience that is around in part and that it is thought that more mistakes have been made than what should be, it is natural that many people feel that Russia is not doing enough and that the country should show more power.
going back to Prigozhin, it really hit his troops hard apparently, the Wagners behaved more like shock troops without as much emphasis on survival as the rest of the Russian army troops in Bakhmut, they lost a large number of men in bloody combat since the Ukrainian resistance was also hard, in summary their units were hit hard without subjectivity, this is so far the most difficult and bloodiest battle of the entire conflict given Prigozhin's character it was clear that he would be upset to some extent if we add to all this the feelings that not much is being done, his men were dying and "no one" seemed to care much, many of his latest statements were becoming more and more sharp and pointless like the special operation didn't demilitarize Ukraine or that the war should have ended in 2014.

I don't see it so much as madness, but as a poor and limited view of everything, plus the guy was getting angrier and angrier with the elite and increasing his resentment for the aforementioned perceptions... it was a matter of time, that Wagner was required to sign contracts with the defense ministry was unthinkable for him and it surely crossed his mind that Shoigu and the Others were clearly doing this to end his organization, subdue him, unacceptable as I already said that after all his contempt for these people, he would come to an end for them, the video that he uploaded to his telegram about an alleged attack on his troops, It still seems false to me and a possible lie to start everything off and I doubt that it was an attack to incite him to react, really, surely he just wanted to protest in an existenceist way by showing power, that was his mistake, he went too far... the protests began passively in Rostov, then rumors came out that Shoigu was there and that he fled and that's why he decided to go to Moscow, for that reason and because he was surely exalted when he saw that the people supported him, and of course why not, he is seen as a patriot, he trolls Ukraine and since many would like to escalate the war to some degree, his protest felt fair, he didn't measure well and he didn't count on Putin responding so inflexibly.
He recently realized that things had more or less ended for him and the people who supported him reconsidered the shock caused by the speech and would not go over Putin since they are faithful to him above all else, they hoped that Prigozhin I would do the same, because if he continued with his actions, a bloodbath would be unleashed, which made no sense since they would lose the battle and it would tarnish the image of Russia or something like that...

the situation was tense and the government did not he gave in, he handled himself well, but the whole matter and the difficulties that arose were the result of the insertion of the particular situation... the march to Moscow was a bad calculation, it should not have been done, Prigozhin reacted But I didn't know much more about what would happen next or I hoped that the government would have a more receptive vision...
I don't think all this was a psychological operation due to the deaths that I doubt were faked, because it would represent a violation of values and to the Russian people by lying to them about lives lost and because I don't see any strategic value, Wagner could now be close to Kiev in Belarus, but the surprise factor would not be there and the same could be done with Russian troops, at most the situation was taken advantage of by Russia to see who was with them and who was not, but I also don't think anyone else would support the demands of the heroic Wagners, they would have believed that a coup would be successful... I don't think they will prosecute Prigozhin, it is potentially dangerous, but it works freer as a propaganda medium, surely the Wagner groups that went to Belarus and Prigozhin himself will be tied to a certain extent, he should no longer care if he saves the Shoigu organization and surely he wants to continue expiating his name and cleaning up This whole situation, I really believe that they pardoned him at least this time for his services, that has value if you want to show the people that redundancy is worth the value, if the charges have not been dropped, I think it is because of a matter of The situation is still in progress and everything is being thoroughly investigated to see if there are no links with international organizations and how many lies there could be.
Also, as @Navigator gator said, all that atmosphere of nonconformity to a certain extent, of popular support and that surely those close to him had similar lines of thought made the ego distort his reality.
 
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So either he was used as a tool by some siloviki clan planning a real coup (with Western blessing perhaps) or... he did it with pre-knowledge and approval from Putin (to give Putin a pretext to drain the swamps, for example, or for another reason).
The death of 12 or more pilots strongly suggests that this was not a psyop done by Putin. Though it is possible that he knew about Prigozhin's plans and let it play out to achieve various goals. And even that is not likely I think.
 
Ok, now the suggestion's been made that Wagner fighters go to Belarus.

What does Putin mean by this? That those loyal to Prigozhin may go regroup with him?
Originally Prigozhin's Wagner was commanded to be deployed to Belarus - Belgorod - ASAP along with Chechen Akhmat. These two special forces were commanded to push southward to create a buffer zone on the Sumi--Kharkov--Kupiansk Axis - cushioning Belgorod - to prevent any further harm of citizens on Russian territory. The plan still makes a lot of sense. Thus execution is a high probability.

Obviously Prigozhin - along with his most trusted loyal commanders & troops - has a very low life-expectancy now that he made blood-enemies in the Russian military, especially aviation.. So if I would be Russian MOD, I would make them cannon fodder: give chance to "redeem" themselves. Essentially Purgatory / Hell on Earth.. for them, thrown into the cauldron.

Expert storm-trooper, Wagner Patriots, loyal to Russia will only enrich the Russian military on the battlefield: I think, giving a good, energizing example of the 'Iron Hand' / 'Might of Russia' striking fear in the hearts of the enemies in combat.

I expect therefore the Wagner - Akhmat flag will be used profusely around Belgorod as Russian PSYOPS in the incoming 'Buffer Zone Creating Special Nothern Operation'.
 
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Lukashenko’s key statements from today via DDGeopolitics:

Lukashenko's long-awaited statements:

🔹 You all read reproaches addressed to me: I have been preparing for war for 30 years. That's the reason why to day we live under peaceful skies

🔹 There are no color revolutions if there are no reasons for this in the country"

🔹 Our generation is undergoing a big test. We have a mission to keep the peace that was paid for by millions of lives of heroes, our fathers and grandfathers. This means only one thing - we must be stronger than the threat that again hangs like a shadow over our land.

🔹 I will not hide, it was painful to watch the events that took place in the south of Russia. Not only for me. Many of our citizens took them to heart because we have the same Fatherland.

🔹 I gave all orders to bring the army to full combat readiness.
 
or... he did it with pre-knowledge and approval from Putin (to give Putin a pretext to drain the swamps, for example, or for another reason).
Have you seen Putin's face when he addressed the people? He was furious, angry to an incredible degree and could hardly contain himself.
So this version with "approval" is unthinkable.
But the fact that Putin knew everything in advance about the impending rebellion is absolutely certain. The situation "smoldered" for months. Even in Bakhmut, they stopped giving Wagner shells and cartridges, because. were afraid of them.

And what if Prigozhin would have not agreed? Went crazy and ballistic? Massacre on both sides? Who would take responsibility for THAT high risk?
Prigozhin had only two options: to agree or to be dead. He chose to be alive. The Wagners did not have a single chance to "make" a coup in the first place. But they could shed a lot of blood. It's good that everything happened more or less peacefully (except for 6 downed helicopters and 20 pilots)

Why wasn't he arrested long ago? For badmouthing the Army for example. Or for "tax fraud"? It doesn't make sense.
This makes sense, because Wagner is a project of Vladimir P. from the day it was founded. Have you not understood this yet? That is why Prigogine could calmly say everything that he said.
But in the end, the project went out of control.

So I've been thinking about why's and for-what's...

This "rebellion" situation is in many ways a situation of greed and stupidity on both sides.
Everything could have ended calmly and peacefully months ago if Prigozhin had been awarded for Bakhmut (the star of the hero) and sent back to Africa with his group.
But he (Prigozhin) was simply put before the fact - to transfer Wagner to the state until 07/01/2023 free of charge and without any conditions, under the wing of the Ministry of Defense of the Russian Federation. In fact, he (practically an oligarch) was driven into a corner and he went for broke, went on a military mutiny.
You remember Putin recently said "leave with what you came with". He remembered Sobchak (the mayor of St. Petersburg, Putin's godfather in fact) and the 90s. These words were addressed to Prigozhin, who came "nobody" (without money and power) to Putin in the 90s.
Give Wagner and leave - these were Vladimir's conditions.

PS.
Here is the confirmation of my words, "give Wagner and leave" - Wagner PMC will hand over heavy military equipment to the Russian army

 
Wagner developments:

0:11: Instead of moving them to Belgorod, now three ~8000 men strong camps are looking to be built SE of Minsk. First camp near the town of Asipovichy. This means 24,000 troops in all. Allegedly they'll be needed to stabilize the imminent presidential elections in Belarus. Also Kiev and Kharkov are conveniently in range for them.

Total number of Wagner troops are estimated by the West to be around 50,000. [1][2]
 
You remember Putin recently said "leave with what you came with". He remembered Sobchak (the mayor of St. Petersburg, Putin's godfather in fact) and the 90s. These words were addressed to Prigozhin, who came "nobody" (without money and power) to Putin in the 90s.
Give Wagner and leave - these were Vladimir's conditions.
He did say that, at his recent meeting with journalists (specifically, war correspondents), but his words were addressed to the issue of Ukraine joining NATO:

"If you want to leave - leave, but leave with what you came with."

I.e., Ukraine can join NATO and become incorporated into the US-UK system, but only those parts of Ukraine containing populations that want to do so. You're not taking any people who self-identify as Russians with you, people who were 'gifted' to you by idiotically idealistic Bolsheviks and Soviets...
 
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