Thinking about time

[Bernardo GA]

I suppose that true scientists will have their own peculiar concept of what time is, and that they find themselves in difficulties because there are things that do not work well, when they want to go beyond.

In this opportunity to exchange with you, I invite you to take part in this search, which has as its main tool, imagination, with a subsequent analysis of what is imagined.

To be more specific, the method would be:

Pretend that we know something, and that we are telling it to someone.
As that someone is fictitious, there is no risk of harming anyone, and therefore we can write with total freedom what we imagine about the subject in question, as if we knew.

Then, we submit what we have written to a demanding analysis. We are willing to remove, change the place of something, substitute something for something that fits better, etc., looking for a coherence worthy of being considered as a possibility.

Of course, the effort to write coherent things must be there from the beginning, even if we are using our imagination.

Otherwise, at the moment of analyzing what is written in the first instance, we will find a lot of useless stupidities that are not worth analyzing.

In my personal searches, I have seen myself doing this on several occasions, and by the results obtained, I could consider it another method of searching, or if you will, of finding.

I have an idea, which requires the participation of others to make it work.

I think it could be interesting, and I am fighting with myself not to fall into anticipation, which reduces so much the potential of things.

In principle the proposal is as follows:

I have written some things from a short time ago, which are a search for what Time might be.
In a session, I don't know the date but not long ago, Ark asked some questions that combined with the answers, made me think a lot.

To organize myself a bit, I started to write down what I was imagining, with the intention of analyzing it later, even during the development of the sketch.

Taking advantage of the fact that I have not yet analyzed it in depth, being then a first imaginative sketch, I will put it as it is, so that the demanding analysis will be that of all those who are interested in it, which will surely be much richer than what I can achieve alone.

Remember that I spoke of making all the necessary modifications so that it has a worthy coherence, and it doesn't matter that from what I said, only the title survives.

Time

I do not know how scientists consider time, but if we keep dividing a chosen pulse, even if we do it millions and millions of times, we will not achieve much, because thought is too restless to stay still to be measured. And much less with approximation resources, which are very useful but for other things, such as organizing our tasks.

Perhaps some thoughts take pity on us, who walk with clocks and centimeters in our hands, and slow down their speed, enough to condense in, and with light, forming matter, and then we make little clay dolls, and we measure them all over, we shape them into little balls and make them roll down the slope running alongside with a stopwatch, etc., etc., etc. Who knows how it all works.

What is clear is that we have to find out what real time is.
For that we could use, among other things, all the curiosities and characteristics that linear time possesses.

We already have something very important, when we see linear time behaving metrically constant, independent or disconnected from conscious life, as something alien to experience.

Then we already have to imagine something that differs from that.
For example, it will not be something independent of souls.
Instead of seconds, or multiples and submultiples thereof, it will have a kind of milestones that will be determined by moments of relevance in experience.

Why moments of relevance? I will have to expand a bit to explain.

The soul, experiencing life, permanently registers information of all kinds, which is stored in its memory.

The soul dwells in an ocean of opportunities to exercise free will, and does so.

Although it acts in its present, all the events of the past, which are recorded, are references and/or influences for its decisions. With this fact alone, we can already hesitate to label something as Past.

Moreover, from a linear view of time, we see the events that have already occurred in a chronological order, one before, one after, etc., but in reality this order has no importance in the memory box except for those that must be seen as one because of the other, remaining together as one and the same event.

The memory box does not need to have its elements ordered in linear time, because the entity will remember this or that particular event by the relation it has to what it is experiencing in its present, and not because it touches this one that is first in the list or row.

In other words, the events will not be reviewed in order of arrival in the memory box. Thank goodness for that!

When the entity remembers some event things happen. Sometimes they are relevant and sometimes they are not. When it learns a lesson, there is an imprint or milestone that marks a moment in its path. And every time it learns a lesson, the footprint will remain.

This path traveled by the soul now already has strong marks, references, which can serve as units or modules, ranging from footprint to footprint or from lesson learned to lesson learned. This could be seen as the seconds of linear time.

Although the delay from second to second is always the same, and in this other case is determined by the activity of consciousness, it still serves us to make comparisons, in this moment of sketching imagination, if such a word exists.

In this grotesque sketch of real time, I will avoid as much as possible that it contains linear time, for the following reason:

Question: do we need a second dimension of time?
Answer: Yes.
Question: Do we need the third dimension of time?
Answer: No.

It seems to me that here, the idea of needing a second dimension of time, is in the sense of another! dimension of time, and not a second dimension of time starting from the first or including it.
To understand each other, I am putting linear time as that first dimension, which will not be part of the other one we are trying to dimension.

This is suggested to me by Ark's celebration, when the Cas answered No, to the need for the third dimension of time.
Clearly Ark gained something important at that moment, because his joy was infectious.

As for me, it made me imagine a lot of things, which I keep telling you about. Apparently, we will have to gradually abandon linear time, even if we are fond of it.

I continue.
Just as all the divisions we make to the second would be its content, in this other case the content between lesson learned and lesson learned, would be all the information in the memory box, that is, the study material to learn lessons.

Everything happens in the present tense

When an event occurs it does so in the present tense; its recording occurs in unison, as does its appearance in the memory box. And, because it is now part of the memory box, it remains in the present, because the memory box is a resource of the present like a library, but more fun.

In this study material, I think that's where the time loops occur.
I don't quite know what they mean by time loops, but I visualize something that maybe they are the famous loops.
Whether they are or not, what I see is located in this study material, and it's a lot of movement in the events every time they are looked at again.

In order not to complicate and go in parts, I will not involve the interaction between entities for now.

When the entity remembers an event, that event becomes the center of attention, but it will move from there, because the entity remembered another event which will move to the center, displacing the previous one, and so on generating a rotational movement, and perhaps with reversal and all.

This could also be seen as one who is reading his personal diary or even a library book, and moving forward in his reading he turns the pages forward, but returning at times to earlier pages, tying up, becoming aware of something, becoming conscious.

When the entity accomplishes this an alchemy takes place. Things happen to the events involved in an awareness. For example: Something that was experienced as something frightening, painful, unfair, that one did not deserve, that is, negative, is transformed into something positive, due to a good connection and understanding of the facts.

This is one of the relevant events mentioned above as milestones.
However, this is still in the orbit of information.
The entity does not expand just by knowing something else.
What it does increase with this is its free will, with its corresponding burden of responsibility.
If the individual in his daily life applies in a constructive way what he now knows, hallelujah! He will be able to generate events that by appropriate decisions will have direct positive results.

These events, which will also be in the memory box, will not only be material for study, but will also be material for consultation, as beacons that will guide the entity, who will be encouraged to continue making good decisions, affirming more and more his path of progress in consciousness.
This, indeed, is expanding.

With respect to the events that have not yet been understood, I see them as small blockages of time or loops, which are on the way back to being understood and thus transformed, because of an eventual wiser look.

Gradually the path of the individual will lose its linear or narrow appearance, and will widen until it becomes a circle.
This circle is bounded by what the entity can encompass with his individual consciousness.
As its consciousness grows, the area of the circle grows, which of course is part of the information field.
In other words, access to the information field is proportional to the consciousness of the individual.

This dynamic imagined here could be extended to encompass all densities.
In linear time, as we know, the sum of seconds form minutes, the sum of these form hours, the sum of these form days, weeks, months, years, centuries, etc., etc., etc.

The sum, which can be used as a mathematical resource or tool, which is its true function, is often used as a weapon of mass manipulation, by falsely attributing to the sum, properties of development, progress and more things, which in reality are due to the combination, and not to the sum.
Unfortunately the masses are human, people with feelings, and that being in an infantile stage, STS of 4D commits child abuse.
Sorry. I got carried away by the rage it still causes me.

I continue.
Returning to the idea, I was saying that the accumulation or illusory sum of linear time, also of illusory nature, generates stages, units, modules, that we call them days, months, years etc.
In real or true Time, the development of consciousness is what generates the different stages of Creation.

Just as we saw the progress of an entity generating modules, or units determined by what has been learned, the different Densities, would be modules or units of greater Time.

The abysmal difference is that the modules or units of linear time are the result of sums, when in the case of true Time, the modules or units of time are the result of the combination and interaction of experiences, leaving the sum of experiences in the realm of illusion.

For now the question that arises for me with all this is:
In real terms, are Time and Path the same thing?

So much for the first instance sketch, to which I did not want to include the interaction between entities, until I had a simple base, but resistant to an increase in complexity.

I hope that someone has been interested in the proposal, and will add a little of his light to this subject, which seems important to me, because both Cas and Ra, use the term Time. They even make distinctions between Time/Space and Space/Time.

I have the feeling that when the Cas said categorically that time does not exist, they were referring strictly to linear time, and in the same act, they were making us participants in a greater reality, something like the first stages of a fusion.

Thank you very much
A hug

Pensando en el tiempo
Supongo que los verdaderos científicos tendrán su peculiar concepto de lo que es el tiempo, y que se ven en dificultades porque hay cosas que no funcionan bien, cuando quieren ir más allá.
En esta oportunidad de intercambio con ustedes, los invito a formar parte en esta búsqueda, que tiene como principal herramienta, la imaginación, con un posterior análisis de lo imaginado.
Para ser mas específico, el método sería:
Hacer de cuenta que sabemos algo, y que se lo estamos contando a alguien.
Como ese alguien es ficticio, no hay riesgo de dañar a alguien, y por lo tanto podemos escribir con total soltura lo que vamos imaginando sobe el tema en cuestión, como si supiéramos.
Luego, sometemos lo que hemos escrito a un exigente análisis. Dispuestos a quitar, cambiar de lugar algo, sustituir algo por algo que encaja mejor, etc., buscándole una coherencia digna, de ser considerada como posibilidad.
Por supuesto, que el esfuerzo por escribir cosas coherentes, debe estar desde el inicio, aunque estemos usando la imaginación.
De lo contrario, al momento de analizar lo escrito en primera instancia, encontraremos un montón de estupideces inútiles, que no vale la pena analizar.
En mis búsquedas personales, me he visto haciendo esto en reiteradas ocasiones, y por los resultados obtenidos, podría considerarlo un método más de búsqueda, o si se quiere, de hallazgo.
Tengo una idea, que requiere de la participación de otros para que funcione.
Creo que puede ser interesante, y estoy peleando conmigo para no caer en la anticipación, que tanto reduce el potencial de las cosas.
En principio la propuesta es la siguiente:
Tengo escrito unas cosas de hace poco tiempo atrás, que son una búsqueda de lo que pueda ser el Tiempo.
En una sesión, no se la fecha pero no hace mucho, Ark hizo unas preguntas que combinadas con las respuestas, me hicieron pensar bastante.
Para organizarme un poco, empecé a escribir lo que estaba imaginando, con la intención de analizarlo luego, incluso durante el desarrollo del boceto.
Aprovechando que aún no lo he analizado a fondo, siendo entonces un primer boceto imaginativo, lo pondré tal cual, para que el análisis exigente sea el de todos los que le interese, que de seguro será mucho mas rico, de lo que pueda lograr yo solo.
Recuerden que hablé de hacerle todas las modificaciones necesarias para que tenga una coherencia digna, y no importa que de lo dicho por mí, sobreviva solo el título.
Tiempo
No sé cómo consideran los científicos al tiempo, pero si seguimos dividiendo una pulsación elegida, aunque lo hagamos millones y millones de veces, no lograremos mucho, porque el pensamiento es demasiado inquieto como para quedarse quietito para que lo midan. Y mucho menos con recursos de aproximación, que son muy útiles pero para otras cosas, como organizar nuestras tareas.
Quizás algunos pensamientos se apiadan de nosotros, que andamos con relojes y centímetros en las manos, y bajen su velocidad, lo suficiente como para condensarse en, y con la luz, formando materia, y entonces nosotros hacemos muñequitos de barro, y los medimos por todos lados, le damos forma de pelotita y la hacemos rodar por la bajadita corriendo al lado con un cronómetro, etc., etc.
Vaya uno a saber cómo funciona todo eso.
Lo que es está claro, es que tenemos que descubrir qué es el Tiempo verdadero.
Para eso podríamos utilizar entre otras cosas, todas las curiosidades y características que el tiempo lineal posee.
Ya tenemos algo muy importante, cuando vemos al tiempo lineal comportarse métricamente constante, independiente o desconectado de la vida consciente, como algo ajeno a la experiencia.
Entonces ya tenemos que ir imaginando algo que difiera con eso.
Por ejemplo, no será algo independiente de las almas.
En lugar de segundos, o múltiplos y submúltiplos del mismo, tendrá una especie de mojones que estarán determinados por momentos de relevancia en la experiencia.
¿Porqué momentos de relevancia? Tendré que extenderme un poco para explicarlo.
El alma experimentando la vida, registra permanentemente información de todo tipo, que queda almacenada en su memoria.
El alma habita en un océano de oportunidades para ejercer el libre albedro, y lo hace.
Si bien ella actúa en su presente, todos los eventos del pasado, que están grabados, son referencias y/o influencia para sus decisiones. Sólo con este hecho, ya podemos dudar a la hora de ponerle a algo, el rótulo de Pasado.
Es más, desde una mirada lineal de tiempo, vemos a los eventos que ya ocurrieron, en un orden cronológico, uno antes, otro después, etc., pero en realidad ese orden no tiene importancia en la caja de memoria a excepción de los que deban ser vistos como uno a causa del otro, quedando juntos como un mismo evento.
La caja de memoria no necesita tener sus elementos ordenados en tiempo lineal, porque la entidad recordará este o aquel otro evento en particular, por la relación que tenga con lo que esté viviendo en su presente, y no porque le toque a este que está primero en la lista o fila.
Dicho de otra manera, los eventos no serán revisados por orden de llegada a la caja de memoria.
¡Menos mal que es así!
Cuando la entidad recuerda algún evento suceden cosas. A veces son relevantes y a veces no. Cuando este aprende alguna lección, queda una huella o mojón que marca un momento en su camino. Y cada vez que aprenda una lección quedará la huella.
Este camino transitado por el alma ahora ya tiene marcas contundentes, referencias, que pueden servir como unidades o módulos, que van desde huella a huella o de lección aprendida a lección aprendida.
Esto podría verse como los segundos del tiempo lineal.
A pesar de que la tardanza entre segundo y segundo sea siempre la misma, y que en este otro caso esté determinada por la actividad de la consciencia, igual nos sirve para hacer comparaciones, en este momento de imaginación boceteadora, si es que existe esa palabra.
En este grotesco boceto del tiempo real, evitaré lo más que pueda que contenga al tiempo lineal, por el siguiente motivo:
Pregunta: ¿Necesitamos una segunda dimensión de tiempo?
Respuesta: Si.
Pregunta: ¿Necesitamos la tercera dimensión del tiempo?
Respuesta: No.
Me parece que aquí, la idea de necesitar una segunda dimensión de tiempo, es en el sentido de ¡otra! dimensión de tiempo, y no una segunda dimensión de tiempo partiendo de la primera o incluyéndola.
Para entendernos, estoy poniendo al tiempo lineal como esa primera dimensión, que no formará parte de la ¡otra! que estamos tratando de dimensionar.
Esto me lo sugiere el festejo de Ark, cuando los Cas respondieron que No, a la necesidad de la tercera dimensión de tiempo.
Es evidente que Ark obtuvo algo importante en ese momento, porque su alegría fue contagiosa.
En lo que a mi respecta, me hizo imaginar muchas cosas, que se las sigo contando.
Al parecer, tendremos que ir abandonando poco a poco al tiempo lineal, aunque le tengamos cariño.
Prosigo.
Así como todas las divisiones que le hagamos al segundo sería su contenido, en este otro caso el contenido entre lección aprendida y lección aprendida, sería toda la información de la caja de memoria, o sea el material de estudio para aprender lecciones.
Todo ocurre en Presente
Cuando ocurre un evento lo hace en presente; su grabación ocurre al unísono, al igual que su aparición en la caja de memoria. Y, al estar ahora formando parte de dicha caja, se mantiene en presente, porque la caja de memoria es un recurso del presente como una biblioteca, pero más divertida.
En este material de estudio, creo que es donde se producen los bucles de tiempo.
No se bien a que se refieren con bucles de tiempo, pero yo visualizo algo que quizás sean los famosos bucles.
Sean o no, lo que veo está situado en este material de estudio, y es mucho movimiento en los eventos cada vez que son vueltos a mirar.
Para no complicar e ir por partes, no involucraré la interacción entre las entidades por ahora.
Cuando la entidad recuerda un evento, dicho evento se convierte en el centro de atención, pero se moverá de allí, porque la entidad recordó otro evento que pasará al centro, desplazando al anterior, y así sucesivamente generando un movimiento rotativo, y quizás con reversa y todo.
Esto también podría verse como alguien que está leyendo su diario personal o incluso un libro de la biblioteca, y avanzando en su lectura pasa las páginas hacia adelante, pero regresando por momentos a páginas anteriores, atando cabos, percatándose de algo, tomando consciencia.
Cuando la entidad logra esto se produce una alquimia. A los eventos involucrados en una toma de consciencia le suceden cosas. Por ejemplo: Algo que fue experimentado como algo espantoso, doloroso, injusto, que uno no se merecía, o sea, negativo, se transforma en algo positivo, debido a una buena conexión y comprensión de los hechos.
Esto es uno de lo eventos relevantes antes mencionados como mojones.
Sin embargo, esto todavía está en la órbita de la información.
La entidad no se expande solo por saber algo más.
Lo que si aumenta con esto es su libre albedrío, con su correspondiente carga de responsabilidad.
Si el individuo en su diario vivir aplica en forma constructiva lo que ahora sabe, ¡¡aleluya!! Podrá generar eventos que por decisiones adecuadas tendrán resultados positivos directos.
Estos eventos que también estarán en la caja de memoria, no serán solo material de estudio, sino que también serán material de consulta, como faros que guiarán a la entidad, que se animará a seguir tomando buenas decisiones, afirmando cada vez más su camino de progreso en consciencia.
Esto sí, es expandirse.
Con respecto a los eventos que aún no fueron comprendidos, los veo como pequeños bloqueos de tiempo o bucles, que andan en la vuelta hasta ser comprendidos y así transformados, a causa de una eventual mirada más sabia.
Paulatinamente el camino del individuo irá perdiendo su apariencia lineal o estrecha, e irá ensanchándose, hasta convertirse en un círculo.
Este círculo está delimitado por lo que pueda abarcar la entidad con su consciencia individual.
A medida que su consciencia crece, crece el área de dicho círculo, que por supuesto, forma parte del campo de información.
Dicho de otra manera, el acceso a la información del campo, es proporcional a la consciencia del individuo.
Esta dinámica imaginada aquí, podría extenderse, abarcando todas las densidades.
En el tiempo lineal como sabemos, la suma de segundos forman minutos, la suma de estos forman horas, la suma de estas forman días, semanas, meses, años, siglos, etc., etc.
La suma, que puede usarse como recurso matemático o herramienta, que es su verdadera función, a menudo es utilizada como arma de manipulación masiva, al atribuirle falsamente a la suma, propiedades de desarrollo, progreso y más cosas, que en realidad se deben a la combinación, y no a la suma.
Lamentablemente las masas son humanas, personas con sentimientos, y que por estar en una etapa infantil, STS de 4D comete abuso infantil.
Perdón. Me dejé llevar por la rabia que aún me provoca.
Prosigo.
Retomando la idea, decía que la acumulación o suma ilusoria de tiempo lineal, también de naturaleza ilusoria, genera etapas, unidades, módulos, que los llamamos días, meses, años etc.
En el Tiempo real o verdadero, el desarrollo de la consciencia es la que va generando las diferentes etapas de la Creación.
Así como vimos el progreso de una entidad generando módulos, o unidades determinadas por lo aprendido, las diferentes Densidades, serían módulos o unidades de Tiempo mayores.
La abismal diferencia está, en que los módulos o unidades del tiempo lineal, son el resultado de sumas, cuando en el caso del Tiempo verdadero, los módulos o unidades de tiempo, son el resultado de la combinación e interacción de experiencias, dejando a la suma de experiencias, en el terreno de la ilusión.
Por ahora la pregunta que me surge con todo esto es:
¿En términos reales, Tiempo y Camino son la misma cosa?
Hasta aquí el boceto de primera instancia, al que no quise incluirle la interacción entre entidades, hasta no tener una base simple, pero resistente a un aumento de complejidad.
Espero que a alguien le haya interesado la propuesta, y le agregue un poco de su luz a este tema, que me parece importante, porque tanto los Cas como también Ra, utilizan el término Tiempo. Incluso hacen distinciones entre Tiempo/Espacio y Espacio/Tiempo.
Tengo la sensación de que cuando los Cas dijeron rotundamente que el tiempo no existe, se referían estrictamente al tiempo lineal, y en el mismo acto, nos hacían partícipes en una realidad mayor, algo así como las primeras etapas de una fusión.
Muchas gracias
Un abrazo

 

[Alejo]

In real terms, are Time and Path the same thing?

I would personally not think so, only insofar as one transverses a path in a given "time"... then yes. But in my opinion, it would be like saying that the road and driving are the same thing, because we drive on roads... but they're independent. I hope I understood what you were trying to convey.

I have the feeling that when the Cas said categorically that time does not exist, they were referring strictly to linear time, and in the same act, they were making us participants in a greater reality, something like the first stages of a fusion.

I always understood their meaning as, it doesn't really exist, it's an illusion created to measure the cyclical nature of the universe, and give it a sense of linearity. Like the borders of countries, they don't really exist, but they're a convention that allows for certain restrictions, to use an example that came to mind.

 

[luc]

I would personally not think so, only insofar as one transverses a path in a given "time"... then yes. But in my opinion, it would be like saying that the road and driving are the same thing, because we drive on roads... but they're independent. I hope I understood what you were trying to convey.


I always understood their meaning as, it doesn't really exist, it's an illusion created to measure the cyclical nature of the universe, and give it a sense of linearity. Like the borders of countries, they don't really exist, but they're a convention that allows for certain restrictions, to use an example that came to mind.

I think the Cs said later that time is how we experience things here in 3D, and that this experience changes in higher densities; so it's not exactly that time doesn't exist, but that it's part of our experience, which ultimately might change.

It might also be useful to distinguish between time as we experience it (a bit like a fish experiences water), sort of a medium in which our consciousness exists at this level, and abstract, "scientific" time, which might indeed be an illusion (McGilchrist sees it as just an abstraction from movement). Fwiw

 

[Bernardo GA]

Thank you Alejo, thank you Luc. Please forgive me if I am slow in replying.

I have not yet mastered the computer tool. Besides, I need to think a lot every time I want to say something. It is not possible for me to have the fluency of a conversation through this medium, even if I would like to. I think I should add something else, so that it is better understood what my concern is.

During the development or approach to the subject, I used "linear time", precisely! because it is an illusion.
That is why it seemed good to me to start looking for something! that differs from that.

That something! that I am looking for is:

The thing to which Cas and also Ra refer, when they! say Time.
We know that they dimension Time in a very! different way from ours.

I am interested in knowing what they mean by Time, because when they explain things to us they say Time/Space or Space/Time, etc.
I am not asking at this moment, the differences between Time/Space and Space/Time, which is also another important topic.
Now what interests me is to know what I put here:

( ? /Space), (Space/ ? )
I am inclined to think that where the question marks are, there is something that exists, and not something that does not exist.

I apologize for not quoting directly from the transcripts of the sessions. I did not know how to find them.
I have in a notebook, textual annotations made at the time, of fragments of sessions, which are the ones that motivated me to this search, and it is this:

Answer: It is necessary to formulate the
interaction of the
consciousness.
You are on your way.
Question: Where do you register the
information?
Answer: By consciousness (laughter).
The information recorded is
equal to time.
Question: Is the quantum theory
related to time loops?
of time?
That there are time loops and
there are many?
Answer: Yes.
Question: Do we need a second
dimension of time?
Answer: Yes.
Question: Do we need the third
dimension of time?
Answer: No.

From another session or maybe from the same one, that too:

Question: What is the purpose of life?
Answer: To learn by organizing bits
of information.
To be expanded.

As I said, this motivated me to search, that to begin with I made that primitive, primitive, rustic, grotesque sketch, which needs to be put through the sieve.

The question that arose at the end derived from that context, but it is not a conclusion drawn. It is simply one of the many questions one can ask oneself, and I hope it is not a limiting factor for the analysis of the text.

Best regards to all. Thank you.

Gracias Alejo, gracias Luc. Sepan disculparme si demoro en contestar.
Aún no domino la herramienta computadora. Además necesito reflexionar bastante cada vez que quiero decir algo.
No me es posible tener la fluidez de una conversación a través de este medio, aunque lo esté deseando.
Creo que debo agregar alguna cosa más, para que se entienda mejor cuál es mi inquietud.

Durante el desarrollo o abordaje del tema, utilicé al "tiempo lineal", ¡precisamente! porque es una ilusión.
Por eso me pareció bueno, empezar a buscar ¡algo! que difiera con eso.

Ese ¡algo! que busco es:
La cosa a la que se refieren los Cas y también Ra, cuando ¡ellos! dicen Tiempo.
Sabemos que ellos dimensionan el Tiempo de una manera ¡muy! distinta a la nuestra.

Me interesa saber a qué se refieren ellos con Tiempo, porque cuando nos explican cosas dicen Tiempo/Espacio o Espacio/Tiempo, etc.
No estoy preguntando en este momento, las diferencias entre Tiempo/Espacio y Espacio/Tiempo, que también es otro tema importante. Ahora lo que me interesa es saber qué pongo aquí:

( ? /Espacio), (Espacio/ ? )
Me inclino a pensar que donde están los signos de interrogación, va algo que existe, y no algo que no existe.

Pido disculpas por no citar directamente de las transcripciones de las sesiones. No supe cómo encontrarlas.
Tengo en un cuaderno, anotaciones textuales hechas en su momento, de fragmentos de sesiones, que son las que me motivaron a esta búsqueda, y es esto:

Respuesta: Es necesario formular la
interacción de la
consciencia.
Estás en camino.
Pregunta: ¿Dónde se registra la
información?
Respuesta: Por consciencia. (risas)
La información registrada es
igual al tiempo.
Pregunta: ¿La teoría cuántica está
relacionada con los bucles
de tiempo?
¿Qué hay ciclos de tiempo y
hay muchos?
Respuesta: Si.
Pregunta: ¿Necesitamos una segunda
dimensión de tiempo?
Respuesta: Si.
Pregunta: ¿Necesitamos la tercera
dimensión de tiempo?
Respuesta: No.

De otra sesión o quizás de la misma, esto también:

Pregunta: ¿ Cual es el propósito de la
vida?
Respuesta: Aprender organizando bits
de información.
Ser expandido.

Como dije, esto me motivó a la búsqueda, que para empezar por algo hice ese boceto primario, primitivo, rústico, grotesco, que necesita ser pasado por la zaranda.

La pregunta que me surgió al final derivó de ese contexto, pero no es una conclusión sacada. Es simplemente una pregunta de tantas otras que uno puede hacerse, y espero que no sea un factor limitante para el análisis del texto.

Un abrazo para todos. Gracias.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

 

[Wandering Star]

I see that the two dimensions of time would depend on where the consciousness is working.

The time in our experience is measured as experienced by our planet, but if we lived in the sun, one day would be 24.47 Earth days according to wikipedia.

In other words, one dimension would be the one that we experience in consensus in our experience and the second would be flexible and variable depending on the location of consciousness.

If we could travel in time, we would change the location of our consciousness to the time of the place of destination, so the second dimension would be that of access to the "playing fields" chosen at will (consciousness).

In the fifth dimension there is no time, that is, the consciousness has access to all the "game zones".

How this can be expressed mathematically is another question.

 

[Wandering Star]

And by the way, I'm not saying that this is so, it's just how I understand it at the moment.

 

[Wandering Star]

And I have thought that one dimension of time would be that of third density and the other would be that of fourth density, which are the two dimensions of physicality and where an individual consciousness operates with physicality (variable in the fourth).

Once again, just my understanding.

 

[zak]

For now the question that arises for me with all this is:
In real terms, are Time and Path the same thing?

With time spent on different paths, time and path becomes and can depend on timing, whether there is good and bad timing is another matter.
And Time and Path with a capital letter, take more time and path to type on the computer, besides having a higher meaning in your question.

The things that were there before and then after us, are not so simple, but in the meantime, let's take 3 minutes and 54 seconds to listen to this song that will have to advance the video 30 seconds to start hearing the beginning of the song, which depending on one's ear will end before the time indicated.

 

[Bernardo GA]

Thank you Zak, for what you have shared.
I am finding your approach very interesting.
I am still analyzing it, and I need you to take me out of a doubt.
When you said: time invested in different paths; do you mean time spent, or is it referring to the direction or sense of time?
The curious thing is that in either of the two options, the content is worthy of analysis. Wow!

A hug.

 

[Alejo]

I am inclined to think that where the question marks are, there is something that exists, and not something that does not exist.

It might be as what Luc described, which I thought was very apt. A medium in which we experience this reality at our level of awareness. Whether it's an illusion or not, I think it's contextual, but Time itself, could be a convention that was useful or necessary for us to interact in this reality.

Another thing that occurred to me is that, some of the answers given where time and space are mentioned, might be very specific to what Ark was thinking when asking the questions, in that sense, time could also be the component of an equation or a mathematical formula to explain reality. Like, the value of "X" for instance, it's not so much that "X" exists, but it is part of an equation that holds a meaning within the equation itself.

It's like gravity, it is both that force that we all understand exists, but in a conversation, it's a concept that has an association to something the speaker is attempting to convey. Does that make sense?

And as such, I think that, if we were to ask the C's what they meant by time, the answer might be different for each occasion. OSIT

 

[Bernardo GA]

Thank you, Alejo. Fascinating! I go to bed happy and thinking.

Hugs

 

[T.C.]

Ever since I worked at Amazon, I had a realisation about how 4D STS relates to 3D STS in the 'As above, so below' sense that answered some questions for me; mostly about how it can be that 'nobody is a nobody' and how the lizzies can possibly track every single one of us, and give us individual attention if we cause them problems. I've thought before about sharing it here on the forum, but in order for me to explain it properly, in the past I would have gone into tonnes of detail. But recently, before you started this thread, it came to mind again but related to the idea of time, and I thought it was interesting. Since you've started this thread on the topic, I'll try to share it now.

My job in the 1,000,000 sq ft warehouse (yes, you read that right), was known as 'Problem Solve'. I had my own department, and my job was to monitor every single customer shipment that was processed during each 10hr shift, which on average, was around 20,000. During peak times like Christmas and Black Friday, this could easily be upwards of 40,000 shipments.

I used a mobile workstation which was a trolly on wheels. A laptop on top, a hand scanner, label printer on the middle shelf, the battery on the bottom shelf. You would be amazed the problems that can occur with a customer shipment while it is being processed in the warehouse. To give you an idea, I need to go into a bit of detail about how it works.

Items are stored in pallet sized racking on isles. These ailes are designed to be accessed by order picking machines:


When an item comes into the warehouse, its barcode is scanned into the system. Then the item is placed into a large cage which also has a barcode. Now the system knows which cage the item is in, and the location of the cage. The cage is then taken by the stower on one of these machines, and put into one of the locations on the aisle. The location is scanned, so again, the system knows where the item is.

When a customer orders the item, a picker is sent to the location and scans the item, places it into their cage, and scans the cage. When their cage is full, they drop it in the packing area and it is scanned again so that its location is logged again. The cage is then taken by a packer and scanned onto their pack station. The packer puts the item in a box and applies a barcode which is scanned. The item location is now classed as the box itself. The box is placed onto a conveyor which takes it from the packing department, upstairs, through a machine that reads the barcode on the box and applies the correct address label, and then onto a larger, faster conveyor know as the 'sorter', which pushes the box down a chute to the shipping department.

The shipping worker then scans the box, stacks it onto a pallet, and the pallet is loaded into a trailer to be taken to the hub, where the item will be sorted and loaded into a van and delivered to the customer.

At every stage in the process, I can see when the item was picked and who picked it, what cage it was picked into, when it arrived into the packing area, what time and which station it was packed on and who packed it, what box it was put into, the number of the barcode applied to the box, when the shipping label was applied, what time it went down the chute, which chute it went down, who processed it in the shipping department, what pallet it was packed on, and which dock door and trailer it was loaded onto.

20,000 items, every detail about each item, from stowed location to trailer, all on a single spreadsheet system on a screen in front of me.
At every stage of the process, there are potential problems which can occur. The item may be damaged. The barcode on the item may not be scannable. The wrong box barcode may be applied to the box. The box may go down the wrong chute, or may not even go down a chute at all. At every stage, items vanish into thin air (1,000,000 sq ft and miles of conveyors), they fall off of conveyors, picking machines break down and items must be recovered from them, packing stations have mechanical issues, scanners stop working, conveyors stop working.

Whatever happens with a shipment, it is my job to fix the issue and make sure that the item gets onto the trailer before the trailer leaves.

Many, many times, I would just stare at 1000's of items moving along conveyor belts and be struck by the 'As above, so below' idea. That humans on Earth are no different to these boxes. How easy it was for me to monitor every single shipment, physically go to where it would be at any moment and give it 'special attention' because there was a problem with it, and 'abduct it' and place it on an 'operating table', open it up, examine the item, fix the issue, send it to be loaded onto the trailer.

It occurred to me recently that the conveyance system itself is like what we think of as 'time'.

For now the question that arises for me with all this is:
In real terms, are Time and Path the same thing?

The box is moving from point A to point B. From location, to trailer, to customer. Like birth, life and death. When I intervene with a shipment, I'm taking it out of this usual conveyance method - taking it out of 'time' - manipulating it in some way and putting it back into the conveyance chain, back into the time continuum.

The company and the engineers who work for them created the conveyance system. The employees (like lizzies and greys) maintain the conveyance system and fix any 'issues' with the shipments. Maybe it's the lizzies who create our 'time'. 3D time is just a conveyor belt created at the level of 4D in order to get humans from point A to point B.

 

[Wandering Star]

mostly about how it can be that 'nobody is a nobody' and how the lizzies can possibly track every single one of us, and give us individual attention if we cause them problems

I have also thought about this, but assuming that what we think in a collinear way in this forum is true, at a planetary level there are very few people.

Even if we add a few thousand who know the same through other means, it would not be a large number.

The farmer immediately knows if any of his cows behave strangely or do things that do not correspond to the established routine.

 

[zak]

When you said: time invested in different paths; do you mean time spent, or is it referring to the direction or sense of time?
The curious thing is that in either of the two options, the content is worthy of analysis. Wow!

A hug.

It includes both, in fact, by "spending time" I could have said "experiencing" life.
To expand my point a bit, I'll give some quotes and personal examples/experiences.

To use Luc's example of the fish in the sea, I swim the breaststroke and the crawl quite well, which doesn't require much effort or attention.
On the other hand, I'm on my third summer of butterfly swimming (the sea is two minutes away), and I still haven't mastered this stroke, which includes two movements, that of the arms, and the famous dolphin-like movement of the feet, and of course breathing, and we can add the state of the sea.
Well, unlike other swims, on the rare occasions when I was able to synchronise everything perfectly by doing the butterfly, I had an experience, like a grace of the movement but also of the spirit, an experience "out of time", which lasts in memory, and internally I can relive it to a certain degree, but at the level of the practise in the sea it depends each time on my abilities and my state of mind, which are also challenged each time.
This reminds me of the different techniques and arts that a Kabuki actor has to master, that in the end you don't have to think about them anymore, but to do them, to unite them in time and to live the experience of the present moment with a purpose, hence maybe the importance of knowing how our cerebral hemispheres work, can help in the process.
To this example of humans in the sea, I can also add that of the seasons, the wind, the rain... as a reflection of time.

"Experience is the master of all things. Julius Caesar.

The company and the engineers who work for them created the conveyance system. The employees (like lizzies and greys) maintain the conveyance system and fix any 'issues' with the shipments. Maybe it's the lizzies who create our 'time'. 3D time is just a conveyor belt created at the level of 4D in order to get humans from point A to point B.

And by the way I just read T.C.'s post, and it takes me back to the first Matrix, and focusing a bit, the scenes where the machines harvest the humans as an energy source.

Unlike the fish in the sea, as human beings we are given the opportunity to progress in a spiritual sense, to find the way to the source, the essence to be again.
This is through work and creativity, with and without a capital letter, and through the fact that by rising through entropy, the latter, as said for the C's, introduces into our experience disruptive elements.
It is a bit like Frodo Baggins, by putting the ring on his finger, he disappears from the sight of his enemies, but also friends, it is double-edged, because by doing so, he signals himself to Sauron, and consequently to the spirits of the ring, the Nazgûl, but also this state "out of time", allows Frodo to see the other side.
And until the last moment, he must fight against himself, and not succumb to his fate, not to say temptation.
In order not to be dazzled by the brilliance of the abyss at the risk of getting lost in it, that brings me to these notions of the C's, Knowledge, Light, Love, and therefore Consciousness, cheerfully discuss in this in Forum.

"Knowledge is acquired through experience, everything else is just information." Albert Einstein.

Thank you Zak, for what you have shared.
I am finding your approach very interesting

You're welcome Bernado GA, I really appreciate your approach too, and your questioning.
It is a difficult subject to define in a framework, because it would be already necessary to find a proper framework to time, and like the butterfly's swim, I am not there, if ever, but that is only an encouragement to persevere over time.

"To live is to transform as much experience as possible into consciousness." André Malraux

 

[Bernardo GA]

Before I add to this mosaic, I want you to know that I am enjoying myself like a little boy opening presents.
The artistic way you are expressing your views is a marvel.

It might be as what Luc described, which I thought was very apt. A medium in which we experience this reality at our level of awareness. Whether it's an illusion or not, I think it's contextual, but Time itself, could be a convention that was useful or necessary for us to interact in this reality.

Another thing that occurred to me is that, some of the answers given where time and space are mentioned, might be very specific to what Ark was thinking when asking the questions, in that sense, time could also be the component of an equation or a mathematical formula to explain reality. Like, the value of "X" for instance, it's not so much that "X" exists, but it is part of an equation that holds a meaning within the equation itself.

It's like gravity, it is both that force that we all understand exists, but in a conversation, it's a concept that has an association to something the speaker is attempting to convey. Does that make sense?

And as such, I think that, if we were to ask the C's what they meant by time, the answer might be different for each occasion. OSIT

Like Alejo, what Luc said seemed to me to be very wise, and he had a good aim, when he pointed to the center of the issue.

I also agree that determining time as an illusion or not is contextual.

I also think that not only has this perception of linear time been useful, but still is to some extent, when interacting in 3D.
While we are in 3D, we can note the plausible inconsistency that linear time has. In fact, the fact that we are discussing it at all is indicative of that.

We do not know what 3D was like, before the alteration of our antennas, carried out by 4D STS, distorting frequency, waves, or whatever of light.

What we do know, is that this linear perception of time, in this 3D we are now, is due to that alteration made by 4D STS.

Although I am wishing it, I prefer not to say the lizards, because I do not know if they were the only ones involved in that event, so just in case I say 4D STS.

These, by their parasitic characteristic, have done this considering only their own benefit.

But! if we get out of the linear look, and consider things from a broader perspective, perhaps we will see that with this, this 3D has become a much more intense school than before. Which makes it interesting to consider, if learning is what Creation is all about.

Of course, if this makes sense, I don't intend to congratulate these unfortunate.

I see that the two dimensions of time would depend on where the consciousness is working.

The time in our experience is measured as experienced by our planet, but if we lived in the sun, one day would be 24.47 Earth days according to wikipedia.

In other words, one dimension would be the one that we experience in consensus in our experience and the second would be flexible and variable depending on the location of consciousness.

If we could travel in time, we would change the location of our consciousness to the time of the place of destination, so the second dimension would be that of access to the "playing fields" chosen at will (consciousness).

In the fifth dimension there is no time, that is, the consciousness has access to all the "game zones".

How this can be expressed mathematically is another question.

Great! I think the Cas would say:
"You're getting lukewarm".

Thanks Wandering Star.

I think we all enjoyed CT's story. It is spectacular.
The parallel you made with the control system, is great.
It borders on the literal, as to the logistics employed by 4D STS to obtain their food.

Perfectly this detailed description of the step-by-step in the chain, the need to take care of failures, how they do it, etc., can serve us for the study of the cage, which we know very well has its weaknesses, and depending on that are our chances of Freedom.

Thank you CT.

There are no shortcuts. Sooner or later, we will realize that to really understand something simple, we have to go through many complexities.

I think all of us here have no doubt that the perception of linearity of time is an illusion. We have already assumed that. But, when it comes to explaining it, we find many nice surprises.

Connections that we had not made before, that increase our understanding, even in other matters.
I don't know why, but something the Cas once said comes to mind: "The geometry of thought requires it".

This is music to my mental ears.

It includes both, in fact, by "spending time" I could have said "experiencing" life.
To expand my point a bit, I'll give some quotes and personal examples/experiences.

To use Luc's example of the fish in the sea, I swim the breaststroke and the crawl quite well, which doesn't require much effort or attention.
On the other hand, I'm on my third summer of butterfly swimming (the sea is two minutes away), and I still haven't mastered this stroke, which includes two movements, that of the arms, and the famous dolphin-like movement of the feet, and of course breathing, and we can add the state of the sea.
Well, unlike other swims, on the rare occasions when I was able to synchronise everything perfectly by doing the butterfly, I had an experience, like a grace of the movement but also of the spirit, an experience "out of time", which lasts in memory, and internally I can relive it to a certain degree, but at the level of the practise in the sea it depends each time on my abilities and my state of mind, which are also challenged each time.
This reminds me of the different techniques and arts that a Kabuki actor has to master, that in the end you don't have to think about them anymore, but to do them, to unite them in time and to live the experience of the present moment with a purpose, hence maybe the importance of knowing how our cerebral hemispheres work, can help in the process.
To this example of humans in the sea, I can also add that of the seasons, the wind, the rain... as a reflection of time.

And by the way I just read T.C.'s post, and it takes me back to the first Matrix, and focusing a bit, the scenes where the machines harvest the humans as an energy source.

Unlike the fish in the sea, as human beings we are given the opportunity to progress in a spiritual sense, to find the way to the source, the essence to be again.
This is through work and creativity, with and without a capital letter, and through the fact that by rising through entropy, the latter, as said for the C's, introduces into our experience disruptive elements.
It is a bit like Frodo Baggins, by putting the ring on his finger, he disappears from the sight of his enemies, but also friends, it is double-edged, because by doing so, he signals himself to Sauron, and consequently to the spirits of the ring, the Nazgûl, but also this state "out of time", allows Frodo to see the other side.
And until the last moment, he must fight against himself, and not succumb to his fate, not to say temptation.
In order not to be dazzled by the brilliance of the abyss at the risk of getting lost in it, that brings me to these notions of the C's, Knowledge, Light, Love, and therefore Consciousness, cheerfully discuss in this in Forum.

You're welcome Bernado GA, I really appreciate your approach too, and your questioning.
It is a difficult subject to define in a framework, because it would be already necessary to find a proper framework to time, and like the butterfly's swim, I am not there, if ever, but that is only an encouragement to persevere over time.

I love the example of the butterfly swim. I have also tried it many times, and only once have I managed to synchronize everything correctly. Those are special moments.

Your example to explain the "now", is very very timely, and gives me the opportunity to comment something.

The sport that I did practice with dedication was Olympic gymnastics. Not at an international level.

One day, the coach told us this:
"In Olympic gymnastics, the word time is almost forbidden. Instead of time we say momentum!"

In teaching/learning, the coach may tell you for example, "When your feet are just past horizontal, it's momentum to raise your hips and bring your shoulders forward with respect to your hand grip. At that momentum you will need to increase your abdominal lock to avoid hyperextension."

Every action you do with one part of your body, shares the same momentum as all the actions of all the other parts of the same body. This is the same for everyone, gymnast or not.

The gymnast's challenge is to know what he is doing with each part simultaneously. In addition, he/she must develop a greater notion of space, in order to be able to interact in space, with the physical laws of this realm.

In advanced stages of the gymnast, he can locate in space, places where to place this or that articulation of his body, axes, pivoting places, etc..
He can even feel the energy of the main axis, which has become almost a solid, from which he should not disconnect, so as not to break the balance in movement.
This axis is also not still in space, but accompanies the dynamics of each particular exercise.

What I mean by all this is that the more awareness we have of our parts, the greater our chances of balancing ourselves.

Thank you. Best regards.

Antes de agregar algo a este mosaico, quiero que sepan que estoy disfrutando como niño chico abriendo regalos. La forma artística en que están expresando sus pareceres, es una maravilla.
Cita [Dijo Alejo...]

Al igual que Alejo, lo que dijo Luc me pareció muy atinado, y que tuvo buena puntería, cuando apuntó al centro de la cuestión.
También estoy de acuerdo en que determinar al tiempo como ilusión o no, es contextual.
Creo también que no solo ha sido útil, sino que lo sigue siendo hasta cierto punto, esta percepción del tiempo lineal, a la hora de interactuar en 3D.
Si bien nosotros estamos en 3D, podemos notar la inconsistencia plausible que tiene el tiempo lineal. De hecho, que estemos discutiendo sobre el tema, es pauta de eso.
No sabemos como era la 3D, antes de la alteración de nuestras antenas, llevada a cabo por 4D STS, distorsionando frecuencia, ondas, o lo que sea de la luz.
Lo que si sabemos, es que dicha percepción lineal de tiempo, en esta 3D que estamos ahora, se debe a esa alteración hecha por 4D STS.
Aunque lo esté deseando, prefiero no decir las lagartijas, por no saber si fueron los únicos involucrados en ese evento, entonces por las dudas digo 4D STS.
Estos, por su característica parasitaria, han hecho esto considerando solo su propio beneficio.
¡Pero! si nos salimos de la mirada lineal, y considerando las cosas desde una perspectiva más amplia, quizás veamos que con esto, esta 3D se ha convertido en una escuela mucho más intensa que antes. Lo que lo hace interesante de considerar, si de aprendizaje se trata la Creación.
Claro, que si esto tiene sentido, no pienso felicitar a estos desgraciados.
Cita [Dijo Estrella Errante...]
¡Buenísimo! Yo creo que los Cas dirían:
"Te estás poniendo tibio"
Gracias Estrella Errante.
Me parece que todos hemos disfrutado el relato de CT. Es espectacular.
El paralelismo que hizo con el sistema de control, es genial.
Roza con lo literal, en cuanto a la logística empleada por 4D STS para la obtención de su alimento.
Perfectamente esta descripción detallada del paso a paso en la cadena, la necesidad de encargarse de las fallas, cómo lo hacen, etc., puede servirnos para el estudio de la jaula, que sabemos muy bien que tiene sus debilidades, y en función de eso están nuestras posibilidades de Libertad.
Gracias CT.
No existen atajos. Más tarde o más temprano, nos daremos cuenta que para entender realmente algo simple, hay que pasar por muchas complejidades.
Creo que todos aquí, no tenemos dudas de que la percepción de linealidad de tiempo, es una ilusión. Eso ya lo tenemos asumido. Pero, a la hora de explicarlo, nos encontramos con muchas sorpresas lindas. Conexiones que no habíamos hecho antes, que aumentan nuestra comprensión, incluso en otros asuntos.
No se porqué, pero me viene a la mente algo que los Cas dijeron una vez: "La geometría del pensamiento lo requiere".
Esto es música para mis oídos mentales.
Cita [Dijo Zak...]
Me encanta el ejemplo del nado estilo mariposa. También lo he intentado muchas veces, y solo en alguna ocasión he logrado sincronizar todo correctamente. Son momentos especiales.
Tu ejemplo para explicar el "ahora", es muy muy oportuno, y me da pie para comentar algo.
El deporte que si practiqué con dedicación, fue gimnasia olímpica. No a un nivel internacional.
Un día, el entrenador nos dijo esto:
"En gimnasia olímpica, la palabra tiempo está casi prohibida. En lugar de tiempo decimos ¡momento!"
En la enseñanza/aprendizaje, el entrenador puede decirle por ejemplo, "cuando tus pies estén pasando apenas la horizontal, es el momento de elevar tu cadera y adelantar los hombros con respecto al agarre de las manos. En ese momento tendrás que aumentar la traba abdominal para no llegar a la hiperextensión"
Cada acción que haga con una parte de su cuerpo, comparte el mismo momento que todas las acciones de todas las demás partes del mismo cuerpo.
Esto es igual para todos, sea gimnasta o no.
El desafío del gimnasta, es saber qué está haciendo con cada parte simultáneamente.
Además, debe desarrollar una mayor noción del espacio, para poder interactuar en el, con las leyes físicas de este reino.
En etapas avanzadas del gimnasta, puede ubicar en el espacio, lugares donde colocar tal o cual articulación de su cuerpo, ejes, lugares de pivoteo, etc.
Puede incluso, sentir la energía del eje principal, convertido casi en un sólido, del que no debe desconectarse, para no romper el equilibrio en movimiento.
Este eje tampoco está quieto en el espacio, sino que acompasa la dinámica de cada ejercicio en particular.
Lo que quiero decir con todo esto es, que cuanto más consciencia tengamos de nuestras partes, mayor serán nuestras posibilidades de equilibrarnos.

Gracias. Un abrazo.