Question about the Five Tibetan Rites

I realize the "rite" is possibly a trigger word for ignoring this subject, let say that is of no value to waste C's time asking about it, I'd like to know if anyone have any experiences with this exercises? It seems that many people use it and hope it's beneficial.

Regarding word "rite" in the name, I didn't find anything ritual in it other then suggested sequence and if that is enough to label something as ritual please let me know. This group of exercises is also known as T5T (the 5 tibetans).

Thanks for your inputs.
 
The only answer i can give you regarding this and based on two people I know of who do this , is the people i know who do it are extremely lazy and self important.
Purely subjective i know , but i dont know anything about it as probably many people here dont and so you did not receive an answer , not because people are "Ignoring" it or "you"

What do you think about it? What benefits do you think is gained from it and why?
 
prasimix said:
I realize the "rite" is possibly a trigger word for ignoring this subject, let say that is of no value to waste C's time asking about it, I'd like to know if anyone have any experiences with this exercises? It seems that many people use it and hope it's beneficial.

I do them from time to time.

Personally, I think they are very good, but only for general fitness and well-being. I see no "rite" in them. They are fairly easy to do, and they seem to work on a lot of muscles at the same time. But you can say the same thing about may other types of exercises, like several yoga movements or postures, swimming, etc.

Maybe others will have something else to add. As with everything else, I don't think that the rejuvenating effects some people claim they have are entirely true, unless these exercises are accompanied by a deep cleaning on your machine at every level.

My 2 cents.
 
Away With The Fairys said:
The only answer i can give you regarding this and based on two people I know of who do this , is the people i know who do it are extremely lazy and self important.
Good to know, looks to them possibly like a quick fix for all problems in their bodies :) Ok, I not hunting for such miracle, but still if that can be somehow combined with EE, 3x33 spinning, and other techniques why not?

Away With The Fairys said:
What do you think about it? What benefits do you think is gained from it and why?
Don't know, I've talked with some people and they told me that is similar to some yoga exercise (whatever that mean). Also that first exercise is in line with suggested 3x33 by Bringers (if I remember correctly) spinning but sequence of just 21 spins.
 
Ailén said:
prasimix said:
I realize the "rite" is possibly a trigger word for ignoring this subject, let say that is of no value to waste C's time asking about it, I'd like to know if anyone have any experiences with this exercises? It seems that many people use it and hope it's beneficial.

I do them from time to time.

Personally, I think they are very good, but only for general fitness and well-being. I see no "rite" in them. They are fairly easy to do, and they seem to work on a lot of muscles at the same time. But you can say the same thing about may other types of exercises, like several yoga movements or postures, swimming, etc.

Maybe others will have something else to add. As with everything else, I don't think that the rejuvenating effects some people claim they have are entirely true, unless these exercises are accompanied by a deep cleaning on your machine at every level.

My 2 cents.

My mom has been doing these exercises for some years now. I can say that physically it may have helped as my mom is in her seventies now and in excellent physical shape and has no health problems of any kind. I don't believe that she has had any other benefits, certainly not in terms of any kind of rejuvenation mentally, emotionally or spiritually.

I'd agree with Alien - the exercises can be helpful, much as any other type of physical exercise would be, but not more than that at least as far as simply doing them without yeah cleaning your machine, self observation, all the hard stuff!
 
I think that the 5 are intended as a condensed routine of exercises that covers the amplest area of muscles/tendons... (that can be covered in 5 simple exercises that is), a most balanced in least time routine so to speak and of course doing anything like that every day will have physical as well as psychological benefits, as would do doing the 10 and the 20 tibetan (if they existed).

So if one could only do one kind of exercise everyday (as opposed to nothing), they are probably a good thing to do, that would explain why they are the exercise of choice of your lazy friends. Less for more, minimum for maximum.

Not to imply that people that do them are lazy, all the opposite, most people do nothing, doing anything (consciously) everyday without having to do it can prove difficult too...

The name is only for adding salt that is my guess, nothing esoteric to be expected osit.

R
 
eliansito said:
I think that the 5 are intended as a condensed routine of exercises that covers the amplest area of muscles/tendons... (that can be covered in 5 simple exercises that is), a most balanced in least time routine so to speak and of course doing anything like that every day will have physical as well as psychological benefits, as would do doing the 10 and the 20 tibetan (if they existed).

R

thank you for the thread . After hearing this from laura on yoga thread and another forumite, I tried this today. I found this to be amazing. The techniques are not new and I was doing them as a part of separate methods I was using, because of their proven benefits( to me) namely spinning ( always brings some inner connection from mundane mechanical ness) , hatha yoga ( viparitakarani and its related ones I use more - takes atleast 15 to 30 min. depending up on what i do) , and surnanamaskaram. Each one takes its own time , so I do very inconsistently, thus loosing the benefit. Though I cherry picked the things I need, I was not sure of the correctness and was little insecure. Well, this is the answer

wiki says
The Rites are said to be a form of Tibetan yoga similar to the more well-known yoga series that originated in India. However, the Five Rites and traditional Tibetan yoga both emphasize "a continuous sequence of movement" (Sanskrit: vinyasa), whereas Indian forms focus on "static positions". Although the Rites have circulated amongst yogis for decades, skeptics say that Tibetans have never recognized them as being authentic Tibetan practices.[6]

to day I did twice , I should say it is very powerful, I only could do some only 6 times ( spine aches more than that) and I will slowly increase it. All in 10 minutes, I should say godsend.
 
Ark's been doing it every morning for years. He likes the protocol.
 
I've done them off and on for about 15 years now. The manuscript that I learned them from had said that the most important one was the 1st one, i.e. spinning. That spinning unblocked all of your chakras forcing them to spin; providing your entire body with a much greater amount of energy. It also said that the other 4 lowered the vibration of the energy close to the physical level and distributed it fairly evenly throughout the cells of your body, and that they also helped pull the energy upward to the higher chakras. The manuscript that I had also talked about a 6th rite that was designed specifically for pulling the energy up into the other chakras. I admit I haven't done the 5 rites in a couple of years. I figured sense spinning was the most important one, and that the C's had also recommended it, I would just do that instead. Just my 2 cents.
 
I have some experience with these exercises and if they are done regularly with close attention on your breathing it can bring some benefits on physical shape, relaxation and so, since they are simplyfied/shortened version of yoga. Good choice for anyone and also for people with less physical abilities. For me Five Tibetans are fine adjunct to all other work on oneself, of course.
IMHO
 
Initially I did them without focus on breathing . After reviewing some more video on the topic, I introduced breathing in and breathing out. breathing in with nose and breathing out with mouth. I see a marked difference in energy level. Also it is mentioned that one should do 6 days a week for complete benefit. I try to do it every day, with some exceptions.

This breathing routine making me think,
- is it worth it to use pipe breathing while breathing out at least ?. breath in and breath out's are for very short duration, so benefit may not be heavy, but is it "some thing is better than nothing "?
- I find it easy and refreshing lay down after 10 minutes of exercise and wondering is it better to do POTS at that time. My personnel exprience body fast falls to relaxed mode with in minutes , is it harmless to do POTS. ?
 
I am pretty certain there is nothing special about these five movements, even though they provide a gentle workout. They resemble, but are not directly connected with the यन्त्र(Yantra) type of Yoga. In Sanskrit, Yantra means something akin to motor or machine. In practical terms, it has flowing movements training the motor functions of the body. Contrast this with the more static Hatha Yoga type of Yoga that appeared some centuries later. As Yantra Yoga appeared in Northern India around 7-9th Century CE, it also made its way into Tibet when Buddhism spread into those regions.
There are some manuals on Yantra Yoga written in Classical Tibetan. That's how I know that they somewhat resemble these five movements that Peter Kelder popularised decades ago. For reference, the only English Translation of a Cycle of Yantra Yoga was published by Namkhai Norbu("Yantra Yoga")
That manual also gives some indication as to what that mysterious 6th rite is supposed to be.

Basically, Peter Kelder really put me off when I first read his book about the Five Tibetans. Typical myth-making story, harkening back to the days of Blavatsky and also to a certain extent, Gurdjieff(the "met a high-level esoteric teacher but won't name him nor what tradition he is from" pattern; makes for great stories but isn't exactly helpful in determining what is credible and what is not)

To clarify what has been written in the OP, Peter Kelder makes the claim that the guy who introduced him to the five movements was a retired army type who just happened to learn these practices in a Tibetan Monastery, where residents apparently slowed down their aging process. Kelder meets the army guy several times and is shocked at how young he appeared to be in the second encounter, despite his stated age.
Of course, he links the rejuvenation effect to the exercises. No in-depth details are given about the 6th movement, which is named as critical to the rejuvenation process. At least he gives the hint that celibacy is a necessity for the 6th movement.

That's basically the story.
Now, for the clarification of the 6th Movement and the ideas behind it.
It's about "sexual energy redirection". Tibetan Buddhists, like their Indian ancestors in terms of teachings, think in terms of energy. You need to keep this in mind if you want to understand this. The basic motivation was that celibate monks became frustrated with sexual restraint and sought a way to make use of this energy that just kept building up as more food was digested. Those who didn't want to use sheer willpower in defeating sexual cravings made use of bandhas(Sanskrit for muscle locks) and breath retention exercises which they noticed to somehow redirect the problem in an upwards direction.
A side effect was also a clearer mind and lots of heat. This gave rise to the gTummo type of exercise that appeared in the Six Yogas of Naropa. This is how practitioners can melt snow or dry wet clothes on their backs.
The heat was a useful side-effect for the cold climate of Tibet, but the actual exercise was for inducing altered states of consciousness and forcing this energy into the "main channel"(sushumna in Sanskrit) which produces all sorts of effects useful for the mind bent on seeking knowledge.
Since I practice this myself and have received this teaching for other practitioners, I can state that it has a rejuvenating effect, most likely due to the better distribution of oxygen as a result of the breath retention and stimulation of the nerve plexuses if you want to dismiss the energy dynamics of traditional Indian/Tibetan/Chinese metaphysics. From what I've gathered from others and experienced myself, it gives rise to these effects: Clear, cool mind, deeper abdominal breathing, shiny face, resistance to cold. If it truly slows down aging itself, I cannot say because I would have to see large groups of practitioners over several decades and compare them to non-practitioners to gather any useful data. And Kelder is right, you have to be celibate for it to be effective, because in these traditional schools, the sexual energy is the fuel which you use to improve your well-being. That's also why practitioners will consume lots of fatty meat if they have access to such things.
The actual exercise is divided into two parts. The first part is about contracting the perineum area(seat of sexual energy according to traditional view), the abdominal area(lifting it up) and the throat region(lowering the head so that the chin touches the base of the throat) and performing a slow, long inhaltion similar to pipe breathing, holding the breath for at least 120 seconds and then violently shooting out the breath through the nose. Gradually extending this to up to several minutes, even though we now know that beyond the 2 minute mark, brain cells may die. This will trigger shaking in the body, strong perspiration, heat and interesting states of mind induced through O2/CO2 imbalance in the brain. So the initial flush of heat is most likely due to a panic reaction of the brain that attempts to increase bloodflow to provide better oxygenation to the body.
This triple muscle lock(basically Maha Bandha of Hatha Yoga) combined with long breath retentions can rejuvenate your mind and body for quite logical reasons, even without going to Stage 2 of this exercise which involves elaborate visualisations that aid this process.
This most immediate effect is a suspension of mental chatter since breath is said to be directly linked with consciousness which is also linked to the body's internal energies(traditional terminology). So if you suspend the breath, the mind will come to a halt, which will likely induce the internal energies, which will improve your health.
That's the basic outline. Of course, this is far more complex than Kelder made it look like and it certainly isn't an easy morning routine so I wouldn't recommend practicing following my short description alone.
But I think it should be obvious that the effects Kelder talks about are likely derived from this 6th exercise and not from the 5 movements, which are an exercise of the motor functions of the body, which, in themselves, may not produce the effects of Kelder's hype, but carry all the benefits of normal physical exercise nonetheless.
 
From what I personally know, practicing these exercises almost daily for around three years now, I may say that T5T are very energizing and strengthening.
They require about 20 minutes to perform correctly, breathing in with the nose, out with the mouth (pipe breathing at the same time is not easy, but you may try).
I don't know if spinning and/or the 6th one are the most important exercises, but you may be confident that the four others are just good and may add to the discipline of the Work, OSIT

Now, all the hype around it is for selling purposes, these guys who try to sell the moon... There might be some truth in it, but anyway I don't think the exercises could harm, if done properly (believing in their lies would bring deception, illusion...)
 
I used to practice the 5 Tibetan Rites. By and large, I did enjoy the exercises, but I moved on to the Eight Brocades and from there I went to practice Xingyi Stretches.

Does it help spiritual growth? The discipline and consistency certainly does. Did it everyday. But overall I don't think so. The spinning certainly gave the morning a different perspective and made it notably easier to concentrate on the tasks at hand. The spinning jostles your brain around, and I felt more detached after it. This can have a role in spiritual growth, I suppose, but I think the practice themselves are nothing special.

Might take it up again. The spinning I mean. Gives a different perspective.
 
Back
Top Bottom