Niacin for Cardio Care and Detox

Johnno said:
Vegemite is a great way to get more vitamin B's into your diet, that and the Aussie Berocca fizzy Vitamin B tablets.
Johnno, you might want to cut down on that vegemite - from what I understand it is an excitotoxin - lots of 'natural' msg in it - here is the thread that discusses that and there is more info on the web -

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=5882.msg47719#msg47719

I've had to cut many of my favorite things out of my diet due to this information - so heads up.

From this web page - _http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articles/archive/2007/08/28/dangers-of-msg.aspx
mercola said:
The list goes on:

"Natural flavorings"

(Parmesan cheese naturally high)

2-aminoglutaric acid

Accent (remember "Wake up that flavor!")

Ajinomoto

Autolyzed yeast extract

Cenovis (Swiss)

EU food additive code: E621

Flavor enhancer 621

HS code: 29224220 (IUPAC name 2-aminopentanedioic acid)

Hydrolyzed vegetable protein

Hydrolyzed yeast

Marmite (Britain/New Zealand)*

Monosodium glutamate

MSG

Sodium glutamate

Soy extract

Soy sauce

Vegemite (Australia/New Zealand)*

Vetsin

These all either are, or are code names for, or are very high in, MSG or other 'free' glutatates. This is one of those things where a little, i.e., naturally-occurring amounts, is okay but a lot becomes a serious problem. Kind of like caffein, where the 100mg in a cup of coffee is sometimes a Good Thing (for example, as opposed to falling alseep at the wheel in traffic!) but 10,000mg (10g) or even 1000mg (1g) all at once would definitely be overstimulation!

FYI, the Brits, Aussies & New Zealanders use the noted* items as a spread on breads etc. or in pastries where we might use fruit jam or preserves. I gather it's a lot like a sort of soy sauce paste made from brewers' yeast. It seems someone in that industry wanted to find a way to sell what they used to have to dispose of, and found a market for it thusly. (The Swiss stuff is in the same general class, I think.) It's the fluoride story all over again!
 
Do not, I repeat, DO NOT take niacin on an empty stomach! My cholesterol has gone up even though I do and eat "all the right things" so I thought I'd try niacin after reading this thread. I got a bottle of the immediate-release type at WholeFoods on Saturday. I took one on Sunday and Monday after dinner and didn't experience the "flush" and since they were in tablet form and since I digest capsules better I thought the tablets weren't getting absorbed so I got the brilliant idea to take it on an empty stomach when I got up for work this morning.

Oh my god, I thought I was going to have to call 911! I started getting a bit tingly and red in the shower, and within five minutes, I was beet red all over, and swelling up. Then I started getting lightheaded, then came the chills. My husband had to leave for work and I was home alone. I'd had an adverse reaction to some NSAIDs last fall and carry an Epi-pen in my purse, so I got it out and just laid on the bed for a while.

Well, I figured I'd better try and get to work so if I passed out, at least somebody would see me and call for help! ;)

So now I'm googling "side effects of niacin" and read "...And large doses of niacin on an empty stomach is certain to cause profound flushing." Not a good idea. Duh.
 
article above said:
Begin with 50 mg. Niacin on a slightly full stomach; increase by 50 mg daily until an immediate flush occurs; do not panic if you turn red or your heart beats rapidly; this is a good sign that your blood is pure and toxins are being removed. Some people have taken as much as 500 mg.
Shar said:
I took one on Sunday and Monday after dinner and didn't experience the "flush" and since they were in tablet form and since I digest capsules better I thought the tablets weren't getting absorbed so I got the brilliant idea to take it on an empty stomach when I got up for work this morning.
How much did you take (in milligrams)?
 
Data. said:
How much did you take (in milligrams)?
The bottle said 300mg. It was the only size they had. I guess I missed the advice above. Also, I read that "serious" side effects include swelling up, as I was doing. I actually broke a fingernail trying to open a foil pack of Benedryll...
 
Just to comment on the Scientology debunking. It's very easy to dismiss anything associated with Scientology (even the niacin detox) when you have someone like Tom Cruise talking in barely comprehensible half-sentences and perky Scientology lingo in a promotional video that appears to be have been edited by an epileptic teenager to showcase Cruise as a grinning, bizarre spellbinding movie star who appears unable to finish a single sentence and suffers from the same level of verbal articulation as a high school football captain. Or a log. A very intense log.

It's no surprise anything even lightly flavoured with Scientology is quickly and aggressively debunked. Maybe we should ask these debunkers to watch "Jesus Camp"? The considerably more deranged spellbinder evangelicals from that particular documentary make Tom look like nothing more than a harmless Boy Scout giddily recounting his World of Warcraft victories after too many aspartame-laced Diet Cokes.
 
I started taking niacin recently. The only tablets I could find were 500 mg, and I hadn't read this thread and didn't know anything about the niacin flush.

You can imagine the type of flush I had when I took ten times the recommended amount! It lasted over four hours. My face was red, my hands were red, I was itching all over.

Now I split the tablets in half and take 250 mg once a day. That seems to give me a normal niacin flush.
 
henry said:
You can imagine the type of flush I had when I took ten times the recommended amount! It lasted over four hours. My face was red, my hands were red, I was itching all over.
:o

Eating some kind of nut right before taking niacin has been helpful in not having an overactive flush (it could probably be helpful when transitioning to higher amounts too). A handful is good, too much and you wont feel it at all.
 
for me the flush gradually lessened and eventually disappeared after continued use. I can't say that I found the flush truly unpleasant though. But going out in public with a bright red face can be embarrassing. Niacin isn't the only thing I do to keep my cholesterol in line but I am sure it helps. Last check my HDL was 74 which is good but I can't seem to get LDL lower than 125 or so. I take about 800 mg a day as part of a multiple in divided doses.

Thomas
 
Protocol for Benzene Detoxification
Taken from the "Rethink" discussion group, 12 Dec 95
Post by William Lamb, Ph.D.
RE: Protocol for benzene detoxification

Dear Stephen Gregory:

Yes, Steve, anything I send to you or anyone is okay for reposting. I appreciate your assistance in making this life saving information available to anyone who will listen.
Most will not believe me; I accept that. But for those that have the guts to take control of their own health and destiny, I have a proven method that will restore your health. It flies in the face of many misconceptions dogmatically supported by the Medical Industrial Complex, but it is truth that can be supported by scientific realities, facts and by which each person can demonstrate for their self in their own body. I was forced to decipher fact from fiction in order to save my own life in 1989.

I have numerous x-ray studies that have been published in scientific chemical journals that show the chemical structure of HIV to be benzene and benzol compounds. When I get the bibliography typed, I will send you a copy so that anyone can go to a major university library and get a copy of these studies. They are surrounded in mystery and HIV doublespeak that can not explain why these benzene masses, they call them "HIV dimmers", are formed.

I'll tell you how they are formed. They are formed as air pollution from gasoline engines. The gasoline in Paris, Africa, Moscow and your town all have one to two percent (1-2%) benzene added to prevent detonation knock. That is why HIV the world over look similar under themicroscope. They are all composed of a six-sided carbon ring compound called benzene.

Regarding your concerns that people who have chronic fatigue, MCS, AIDS and other environmental illnesses do not tolerate sunlight well. That is absolutely correct, but that is also the reason that UV light (sunlight) is the fastest and most powerful way to reverse these conditions.

However, there are two approaches to detoxification of an acquired benzene condition. There is a biochemical approach and a photobiochemical approach. That is why the title of my protocol has both of these terms. Used together, they work synergistly for the fastest recovery and maximum benefit. But each procedure will also work independent of the other.

As John Javilk pointed out, yes, the health body can break down benzene, even toxic benzene to some extent. But when the human body is exposed to high levels of toxic hydrocarbons acetaldehyde and benzene from the high levels of invisible air pollution, the immune system is depleted day after day and year after year until you are said to have acquired an immune deficiency. You acquire this benzene buildup over time because your body does not have enough of the essential nutrients to detoxify the quantities of hydrocarbons taken in. Therefore, you have developed massive nutritional deficiencies at the cellular level and it is these deficiencies that prevent the body from breaking down these toxins. When you provide these deficient nutrients in sufficient quantities, the body is then able to break down these benzene compounds and recover.

This is not academic theory I cite but absolutely proven personal experience and documented case studies. You will note that I published my findings about five years before Hulda Clark published her book. And I know a few things that she has yet to discover. Don't get me wrong, I respect Dr. Hulda Clark and say that she single handedly accomplished more that all the entire United States government agencies combined with over six billion dollars ($6,000,000,000) for research in ten years. But Hulda Clark did not and has not cured anyone of AIDS yet.

She has converted several to P-24 Antigen sero-negative and greatly diminished their toxic benzene condition. However, she also reports that many of those that she converted to sero- negative were sero-positive again by the time her book went to print. She attributes that to the fact that they were reinfected with flukes.

I say she is wrong about this one detail. There is such a thing as flukes and she found some, which her herbs killed. However, I believe it is the high levels of Nitrogen compounds in the walnut hull tincture that broke the benzene polymer chains that were forming in the victim's bowel. This flushed benzene masses and benzene polymer chains out with the bowel movement.

Dr. Clark isolated and photographed these masses and they are shown on page two of her book, The Cure for HIV and AIDS. She says the black hairy legs are strings of eggs. I say she is wrong; they are benzene polymer chains. You can not cure AIDS until you shut off the continued exposure to benzene and Dr. Clark does not recognize that there are massive benzene clouds that hang over all major freeways and metropolitan areas.
The x-rayed chemical structures of HIV-I, HIV-II and LAV/HTLV-III do not show fluke structures throughout the muscles, bones and vital organs of these individuals. They show masses of benzene compounds. These masses will not break down and go away with a few herbs. Dr.Clark will have to admit that I am right before she is through. In the mean time you might as well get started on a cure that works, and will continue to work for the rest of your life.

Now to address your problem and the problem of many others in detoxifying benzene. If the sun makes you sick, stay out of the sun and start my Nutritional Detoxification protocol. Start slowly, but remember the slower you go, the longer it will take. Eventually you must take aggressive action to reverse these conditions or they will only get worse. I recommend:

1) Eat Fresh whole lemons or the inner white peeling and the lemon juice. The cytochrome enzymes are very powerful benzene detoxicant as well as the niacin, vitamin C and phosphates in the lemon. I ate 10-12 per day after I got started.

2) Take high levels of niacin. Start at 50-100 mg two to three (2-3) times per day and see how bad the flush, itching and headache level will be. Gradually increase and take what you feel you can tolerate. The longer you are on it, the more you can tolerate until it will not have a noticeable effect once your body is detoxified of benzene. I took 1,000 mg at two-hour intervals for a total of 10-12 grams per day for about three months. Most people will not tolerate the side effects of half that much. I say how fast do you want to get well?
There have been reports posted on the internet cautioning people about the adverse effects of taking niacin. These are not due to the bad effects of the niacin, they are due to the bad effects of the benzene concentrations in these individuals. Without enough niacin, the detoxification of benzene can produce small areas of Nylon 6 polymer scars. The niacin critiques blame these wart-like scars on the wrong causative agent. Treatment with ultra Violet light therapy will eventually remove these scars.

3) Take high levels of B-complex. Due to the high amount of the intestinal wall that is polymerized and the diminished absorption factor, I took B Total liquid by mouth and B-12 by Nasal gel as well as the pill forms. High levels of B-3, B-6 and B-12 are particularly critical. Judge the amount of B vitamins your body needs by the urine color. If the urine is clear, your body is using up all the B vitamins you are taking, even though you may be taking 30 to 300 times the RDA. You need to take enough to keep your urine a light straw color, if possible for optimum benzene detoxification. If your urine is brown in color and has an odor, this indicates that your body is flushing out nitrobenzene, phenol compounds and benzyl compounds. Eliminate you continued exposure to benzene and intensify your detoxification efforts and this will go away with time.

4) Take vitamin C supplements, esther form, if possible. AIDS individuals and people with acquired benzene conditions do not tolerate vitamin C very well either. Actually it is the benzene compound that can not tolerate the vitamin C. It like the niacin and B-complex may cause skin eruptions of a silvery-white powder as the benzene is detoxified. Do not be alarmed if this should happen. It is a beneficial side effect of benzene detoxification. It may also cause headaches as the benzene compounds on the brain are detoxified. Don't take so much supplements that these two side effects become intolerable.

5) Take an amino acid supplement that contains all essential amino acids, eat a high amino acid and cholesterol diet and take additional supplements of sulfur containing amino acids particularly cysteine and/or glutathione.

6) Take quinine sulfate, iron sulfate and zinc sulfate. I worked up to 1,000 mg of quinine sulfate a day, which I divided into spaced intervals. Quinine has a unique branched carbon structure that is beneficial in detoxifying benzene.

7) Take calcium, phosphate, vitamin D, vitamin A, vitamin E and magnesium supplements. I took about three to five times the RDA of dicalcium phosphate with vitamin D. This not only helps to detoxify the benzene but also replaces the NAD and NADP coenzymes that are essential for the immunity and health of each cell. The magnesium deficiency must be overcome to restore normal neurotransmitter hormone function and eliminate mental depression and anxiety.

8) To prevent cataracts from forming and to remove cataracts that have formed, take the amino acid glutathione, vitamin B-2, B-3, B-6, B-12, B-complex, vitamin C, calcium potassium and selenium. These work to detoxify the benzene compounds in the eye that cause the cataracts. Prolonged benzene exposure can lead to benzene formations in the lens of the eye. This benzene induces cross linking of soluble and nucleic acid proteins. These benzene polymer chains appear as a mass of white thread-like structures that cloud the lens of the eye and greatly diminish the normal transmission of light through the lens into the eye. The current medical practice is to surgically remove the clouded lens and replace it with a permanent plastic eye lens that grows back into the eye.
I had some of this clouding of the lens and was able to break down the benzene and benzene polymer chains with indirect UV light from the tanning bed facial units over the period of several months.
This cured the condition without surgery. However, you MUST be very careful not to over expose the eye or take direct UV rays into the optic nerves which will result in extreme pain for several days and may damage the eye.
The biggest risk of cataracts from benzene exposure is inside the eye, which they refer to as a central nuclear cataract. The benzolglucoseamine form goes into the aqueous humor. Due to the deficiency of glutathione within the eye, the benzene is not immediately detoxified and the sunlight breaks down the benzene and the white benzene carbon masses are free floating or can attach to the iris where they block the transmission of light. It took me some time to understand and document this process, so I was almost blind in 1990 before I figured out how to reverse this process with nutrition and UV light therapy.
That is why I am keenly aware that as you are detoxifying the rest of your body from benzene, you need to monitor the possible formation of cataracts so that the cataracts may be prevented and cured without surgery.
Now, all these biochemical benzene detoxification procedures will work regardless of whether you expose your body to UV light or not.
If however, you will try the tanning bed treatments (Photo-biochemical Benzene Detoxification Treatments), you will more than double the speed of your recovery and return to a healthy immune system. I found that two hours of sun would make me very ill with flu-like symptoms, elevated temperature, nausea, headache, incredible aches and pains as well as congestion of the lungs like a severe case of the flu. Like you, it would take me one to three days at least, to recover my former strength. So I know what you and others are experiencing. I found that I could tolerate the UV light treatment better in a tanning booth with two fans for maximum cooling during and after the exposure. If you start with low exposure times of say 10-15 minutes per treatment and take at least three and preferable five treatments per week, you will soon find that the treatments will become less traumatic and your exposure times can be increased. I expect that by the end of two weeks you will be feeling better and want to extend the exposure time to 30 minutes per day and take a treatment every day. The more UV radiation, exposure time, that you get, the healthier you will become and the more exposure time you can tolerate. Soon you will feel so good and have so much energy that you will feel depressed and drained unless you get your daily UV light treatment. At this point you must continue the UV light treatments at least several times per week until your body is completely detoxified. Once you see this miracle of light in your own body, you will be like me and want to tell everyone how to prevent and cure these conditions. But you will find like I have, that most people will NOT believe that it is that simple to cure AIDS, MCS, cancer and other acquired benzene conditions. I hope this is helpful.

Respectfully,
William Lamb, Ph.D.
Research Director

_http://members.toast.net/boydo/benzene.html

On William Lamb, PhD:

KeepAlive said:
In a book titled: How I Cured Myself of AIDS, William Lamb writes: “In August, 1989, I had a fully developed case of AIDS and was near death. I had developed a condition known as Kaposis Sarcoma and reddish-purple splotches had appeared all over my body. My lungs were black on the x-ray due to massive amounts of pneumocystis carinni pneumonia.
In a telephone interview, Dr. Lamb told me that at his worst, he was 60 lbs. underweight and had swollen lymph nodes and night sweats. He claims his recovery was due to taking large amounts of all the B vitamins and particularly niacin, which he claims generates a heat reaction and breaks down the HIV virus. He also said he tanned in a salon for 1/2 hour each day continuously to receive ultraviolet light to kill the HIV virus. He said he ate 10 raw lemons each day and also took quinine sulfate tablets. There are some other details on supplements in his book. He claims that 3 weeks of this treatment got rid of all his KS lesions. For more information, you may contact him at RR1, Box 298, Jerico Springs, MO 64756.
_http://www.keephopealive.org/report9.html
The book is out of print on Amazon. _http://www.amazon.co.uk/How-cured-myself-AIDS-self-treatment/dp/B0006FAJ3M

Has anyone read his book or heard of this fellow before? I'll write to him and see where I can get a copy of it.


Hulda Clark’s take on Niacin and benzopyrenes.

Cure for All Diseases said:
Grilled food develops benzopyrenes in it that are very toxic. (snip) Benzopyrenes must be detoxified using the liver's valuable benzene-detoxification system. With so many benzene-polluted items, there is hardly enough detoxification capability to get it all taken care of. NAD enzymes (the N stands for niacin) come into play too. Supplements that help your body to detoxify the benzopyrenes are:
1. Niacin or niacinamide. These are NAD-builders. Take 50
mg with each meal.
2. Vitamin B2 (riboflavin). Take 50 mg with each meal.
http://www.drloyd.com/cure.pdf
 
50megz said:
Has anyone read his book or heard of this fellow before? I'll write to him and see where I can get a copy of it.
Hi,

Interesting thread. I'll be interested to see if you get a response, you sure can't find much about him online. I even tried the way back machine, the links wouldn't work or you were redirected to this same article.
 
This should be helpful for those who have a hard time tolerating the sun because of illness. I've tried it and it works.

Oil protien diet, Dr. Johanna Budwig.

Flax Oil as a True Aid, Pg 53:
"Doctors tell cancer patients that they should avoid the sun; that
they can't tolerate it. That is correct. The moment, however, that
these patients--cancer patients as well--have been following my oil-
protein nutritional advice for two or three days, which means that
they have been getting sufficient amounts of the essential fats, they
can then tolerate the sun very well. Indeed they emphasize how fine
they suddenly feel in the sun--how much their vitality and vigour is
stirred and stimulated......."

The rest of the page explains the very important relationship between
the sun, seed oils , and all our vital functions.

According to Dr.Budwig the tolerance for sun
increases with the consumption of highly unsaturated seed oils such as flax oil and cottage cheese.

Just put 2 tablespoons of flax oil and 4 tablespoons of lowfat cottage cheese. Blend quickly, just enough so you can't see the oil sitting on the CC. You can use more just be sure that the CC is double the Flax oil.

Quark, homemade yogurt cheese or kefir cheese is OK to use instead of the Cottage Cheese.
 
Tina said:
50megz said:
Has anyone read his book or heard of this fellow before? I'll write to him and see where I can get a copy of it.
Hi,

Interesting thread. I'll be interested to see if you get a response, you sure can't find much about him online. I even tried the way back machine, the links wouldn't work or you were redirected to this same article.
The letter was returned undeliverable, unable to forward. More searching required:-)
 
I've just started Niacin, I took 200mg on an empty stomach (never again that flush is no joke :-[. ) I'm going to go down to 100 and increase gradually.

I noticed the post about balancing neurotransmitters with 5-htp which I used to take but not any more after finding the following information.

Dr. Steven B. Harris, M.D. is a famous doctor and gerontologist who has posted for years on various medical and scientifically-oriented Usenet newsgroups like sci.med.nutrition, sci.life-extension, and numerous others. The material following this paragraph is a copy/paste of something on another site, in response to a question about the use of 5-HTP:

------------------------------------------------------
For those of you who continue to think that taking 5-HTP is a perfectly safe thing to do, please read the following post by Dr. Steven Harris (a well-known life-extension researcher) from the science newsgroup sci.life-extension. This material is lengthy and _quite_ technical, but you need to work your way through it so that you can see why 5-HTP isn't a benign substance:


From: sbharris@ix.netcom.com(Steven B. Harris)
Subject: 5-HTP + B6 = Trouble; Doc Harris Presents Green Banana Award (was: US ban on tryptophan)
Date: 29 Dec 1996
Newsgroups: sci.med.nutrition, sci.med, sci.pharmacy, misc.health.alternative, sci.life-extension, alt.support.depression

Simon Friedman wrote:

Jack Challem wrote:
> If you look around, you will find a few companies now selling tryptophan supplements to doctors in the US. The molecular structure is slightly different, basically just the immediate precursor molecule. I checked with my FDA contact, and he said yes, it's true.<

>>You can also buy 5-hydroxytryptophan from at least 2 mail-order outlets that I know of. 5-HTP is the next step in metabolism from trypophan on its way to become serotonin. Simon<<
------------------------------------------------------------

Comment: Yes, and in fact 5-HTP needs only one more step to become serotonin-- a decarboxylation. The sequence is:

Tryptophan --> 5-HTP --> Serotonin.

An exactly analogous sequence is:

Tyrosine --> L-DOPA --> Dopamine

In both cases the end product neurotransmitter does not get across the blood brain barrier very well, but all of the precursor molecules above are transported by the brain's large neutral amino acid pump, and they get into the brain fine. Thus, if you are a Parkinson's patient who wants to raise dopamine levels, you must take L-DOPA, not dopamine. Similarly, it would do you no good to take serotonin-- you must take tryptophan or 5-hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP).

Now for the complications. (Aren't there always complications in life?) The final reaction to the neurotransmitter in both the case of dopamine and serotonin, is decarboxylation, and the same enzyme (the aromatic L-amino acid decarboxylase) is involved in both conversions. This decarboxylase enzyme is present in the liver, and it acts in the case of L-DOPA to convert the compound to dopamine before it can make it into the brain (and if this happens, the L-DOPA is wasted). The decarboxylase enzyme uses B6 as a cofactor for this reaction, and for this reason a Parkinson's disease patient taking L-DOPA cannot take more than the RDA of B6, because doing so would act to neutralize oral L-DOPA too quickly. These days, almost all Parkinson's patients on L-DOPA take the drug in a combination with an artificial decarboxylase inhibitor, called Carbidopa (the combination is called Sinemet). But even with Carbidopa, Parkinson's patients are advised not to exceed a daily dose of B6 of 25 mg, since more will overwhelm the Carbidopa effect, and cause pharmacologic L-DOPA to be destroyed in the liver before it can get into the brain.

Now, Carbidopa, because it acts on the same metabolizing enzyme in the liver, performs exactly the same preservative service for 5-HTP as for L-DOPA. For this reason, neurologists have experimented with giving Carbidopa to people who needed to take 5-HTP to raise brain serotonin (this in the days before selective serotonin re-uptake inhibitor antidepressants like Prozac were available). The problem today with 5-HTP-selling companies bypassing doctors and going to laymen, is that a lot of health enthusiasts with problems who are enthusiastically taking 5-HTP are NOT taking Carbidopa, but they ARE taking a lot of B6 in one form or another. Yet without Carbidopa, more than a few milligrams of extra B6 per day would be expected to insure that most dietary 5-HTP gets turned into serotonin before it can get into the brain.

Alas, one company I know packages their 5-HTP in 50 mg capsules with 10 mg of B6. They do this ostensibly so that 5-HTP can be converted to serotonin in the brain. Duh. This insures that any 5-HTP will get converted to serotonin in the liver instead, and thus never make it to the brain. Vitamin B6 is the *LAST* thing you want in an 5-HTP product.

At the very best, people who take B-vitamins with 5-HTP, or who take 5-HTP products with B6, waste their money. All this would be merely humorous (caveat emptor) were it not for some other facts. At worst, ignorant people fooling with 5-HTP actually risk their health, since serotonin in the peripheral blood is not benign. Serotonin causes not only harmless flushing and diarrhea, but people with serotonin secreting tumors (hindgut carcinoids) also have problems with fibrosis of the endocardium and valves in their right hearts, which can cause heart failure. This fibrosis is caused by the serotonin. This effect can also be seen with dietary intake of only modest amounts of serotonin, and there has actually been described in the medical literature a tribe of South Sea islanders with right heart fibrosis as a result of eating green banana mash (matuki), which poisons them with its serotonin content. No, I'm not making this up. The hydroxylation of tryptophan is a rate-limiting step in the peripheral production of serotonin, and one bypasses it at one's peril.

How much does it take? Several hundred milligrams of 5-HTP taken per day, if converted to serotonin, would result in a urinary excretion of the serotonin metabolite 5-hydroxyindoleacetic acid (5-HIAA) of several hundred milligrams also-- an amount well within the urinary excretion range of the average person with a serotonin producing carcinoid. Such a dose of 5-HTP certainly would result in a serotonin blood load comparable to that of green-banana-diet eating people who have serotonin-induced heart valve disease. Normally, people do not excrete breakdown products of more than 10 mg of serotonin metabolites per day. If you take one capsule per day of 50 mg 5-HTP with 10 mg B6, however, you would be expected to go to at least 50 mg per day of 5-HIAA in the urine. Less metabolism in the liver (less B6) would result in less 5-HIAA in the urine. If you are going to take 5-HTP, therefore, you probably need 5-HIAA urine monitoring, to figure out just how big a dose of systemic serotonin you're actually getting (and incidentally, how much 5-HTP you're wasting). See a doctor!

For all the reasons outlined above, I am presenting those vitamin companies who sell 5-HTP with B6, or who sell it alone but don't warn their customers about 5-HIAA monitoring or B6 intake, a special award: the Green Banana Award. This honor is for those supplement-sellers who monkey around with people's health before consulting with some really good nutrition and medical specialists to make sure they don't f*&% up and hurt somebody. Hopefully, companies which receive the Green Banana Award will contemplate its message, and will thereby change their behavior in order to avoid some of the less-coveted awards which otherwise await them in the future: the Civil Damage Award, for instance, or even the All-Expense-Paid Guest of the Federal Government Award.
 
Meg said:
Tina said:
50megz said:
Has anyone read his book or heard of this fellow before? I'll write to him and see where I can get a copy of it.
Hi,

Interesting thread. I'll be interested to see if you get a response, you sure can't find much about him online. I even tried the way back machine, the links wouldn't work or you were redirected to this same article.
The letter was returned undeliverable, unable to forward. More searching required:-)

Well, I guess I'm not really surprised. Thanks for letting us know. :flowers:
 
Moonwalker said:
Dr. Steven B. Harris, M.D. is a famous doctor and gerontologist who has posted for years on various medical and scientifically-oriented Usenet newsgroups like sci.med.nutrition, sci.life-extension, and numerous others. The material following this paragraph is a copy/paste of something on another site, in response to a question about the use of 5-HTP:

------------------------------------------------------
For those of you who continue to think that taking 5-HTP is a perfectly safe thing to do, please read the following post by Dr. Steven Harris (a well-known life-extension researcher) from the science newsgroup sci.life-extension. This material is lengthy and _quite_ technical, but you need to work your way through it so that you can see why 5-HTP isn't a benign substance:


d.

Very few things if any are always safe. Actually in an aging body after years of wrong eating and so on, 5-htp may have even greater negative effects. Everything however has its side effect and I agree that 5-htp is certainly not immune.
What I know from experience (in animal models fWIW) is that not all of the 5-htp is decarbocxylized by the liver. Some actually makes it to the brain, enough to affect behavior. I wouldn't recommend it long term but that's just my view of most drugs.

As for the studies, well there have been many. Carbidopa isn't so great either and I think people with pre-existing heart issues and other preexisting conditions probably should not take 5-htp but it isn't as bad for otherwise relatively, and I stress relatively healthy individuals. A good understanding of dose response and pharmacology of the drug is important. Of course a lot will get metabolized by the liver, again not all and once it gets to the brain, a lot isn't needed to be effective.


So even though it isn't perfect, I think it is better than other drugs touted as antidepressant treatment. If anyone wishes they can do a pubmed search if they have the time. There is also a wiki article I quote from below. I suffer hormonally induced migraines, believe me when I say this helps tremendously but again I don't take it long term. For concerns about effects on the heart, I take magnesium but that's just me. I wouldn't throw out the baby with the bathwater and always check with your health care provider first.

One study I am familiar with is:
Zmilacher K, Battegay R, Gastpar M. L-5-hydroxytryptophan alone and in combination with a peripheral decarboxylase inhibitor in the treatment of depression. Neuropsychobiology 1988:20-28- 33

http://endotwikipediadotorg/wiki/5-HTP
5-HTP has been shown to be as effective as imipramine for the treatment of depression.[9]
Current research shows promise in using 5-HTP for treating children with night terrors. After six months of use 83.9% of the children treated with 5-HTP were free from their persistent sleep terrors.[10]
Some persons with fibromyalgia find that 5-HTP improves their symptoms.[11] Fibromyalgia sufferers report improvement in sleep, depression, pain and all major complaints related to fibromyalgia.[12] Studies are continuing to refine dosage and continued use.
It is also used as a prophylactic against chronic daily headache.[13] 5-HTP may also be useful in treatment for migraines, since studies have shown that migraines occur when serotonin levels are low.

 
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