Dream Self

Al Today

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I had a dream last weekend that was so profound (to me) that I just cannot stop thinking about it. Before I begin, we need two basic definitions for this illustration. As I lay down and begin to sleep, let’s call this my sleeping self(1). Within the dream, let’s call that my dream self(2).

In the dream, my dream self was in some sort of building/grounds/complex. All types of people were there. Every color, shape, size, type, and variety, going about their business. Kinda like a small, self contained city. There were individuals by themselves as well as small groups of people congregating with each other.

My dream self came to realize that ‘it’ was in a dream. My dream self then wondered about my sleeping self. My dream self could ‘see/feel’ my sleeping self. My dream self tried to access, to communicate if you will, with my sleeping self. My sleeping self immediately woke up, wide eyed and feeling the presence/existence of my dream self. The intense feeling of being two(2) existing, separate, yet the same entity(ies) kinda sorta still sticks with me.

I went back to sleep with the intent of continuing that dream. And I did… My dream self wondered if my sleeping self could have multiple, simultaneous dreams with other selves. My dream self wondered about all those other people within the dream. Are they figments of my imagination, formulated for the dream, or are they ‘dream selves’ of other people? My dream self wondered if my sleeping self was part of a bigger dream. (This is hard for me to explain). My dream self wondered about it’s death, was unafraid and did not see death as an end of existence, but as an end of a journey, an end of an experience.

My sleeping self again woke up and wondered what my dream self was. Was my dream self an individual entity, ‘living’ only for that brief dream? Or was my dream self a ‘piece’ of my sleeping self, an extension, a ‘piece’ of the ‘original’? I wondered about the possible ‘death’ of my dream self, in relation to like we are all gonna ‘die’ here.

Wide awake now, I began to think about this 3D ‘life’, right ‘now’. Is this all a dream?
I can only ask the following question with 3D ability, are we all dream selves of some sort of other self we cannot comprehend? Weird eh? Was this dream wishful thinking resultant from what I have read over the years? Or was this dream some sort of confirmation? I dunno but I had to jot all this down and post…
Thank you very much…
 
Reminds me of Carlos Castenada's books.

You ask "Is this all a dream." Or you could say the world is a stage where we take part, playing out our roles so well. I think about these things too. If one could just rise above the everyday issues, that is detach oneself from the world in a sense, and try to look at the bigger picture, without getting entangled in the small details, then a lot of things would seem funny or futile or useless.

Happy dreaming..
 
Well, now that you mention it,

C's said:
Q: (L) Okay, can we ask now about El Chupacabras?
A: It is what it is.
Q: (L) It is a 'goatsucker.' Where does it come from?
A: Review transcripts re: "window fallers."
Q: (L) If it is a window faller, does it come from another density, or a lateral dimension?
A: Closer to the latter.
Q: (L) Okay, so it is like a horizontal dimension. What allowed it to enter our realm?
A: This is complex, but best described as "EM wave bursts along frequency border variation."
Q: (L) Is there some way to capture or stop this creature?
A: You do not yet completely understand all the "mechanics" of the window faller phenomenon. The physicality is entirely transitory and partially dependent upon consciousness variabilities, as well as expectations of witnesses.
Q: (L) Does the energy of the fear of the witness enable the creature to continue its existence? Does it feed on the
excitement and fear, and is that what makes it manifest?
A: Close, but off a little. It is the other way around, and retro-factored by one half.
Q: (L) What do you mean by that?
A: It is mutual, rather than unilateral. Also, remember that a window falling represents a cross-energizing of realities, equally represented from each "dimension" in question. In other words, because the dimensional curtain has been "torn," half of one and half of the other contributes to the whole reality.
Q: (L) Does this mean that something from our reality is also scaring something in that other reality?
A: No, it does not "work" that way at all.
Q: (L) Is there any possibility that this mutual creature is going to turn its attention from animals to humans?
A: Ditto last answer. And review response prior to that!
Q: (L) Okay, now, there are a lot of current teachings that say that the 'dregs' of other planets are being sent to Earth to 'refine' them, so to speak, and that this is why the human race is so divided and antagonistic... that the interactions are supposed to result in annihilation of the weak and survival of the strong in both physical and spiritual terms.
A: First of all, confusion abounds here due to incorrect interpretations of the last subject discussed. Dimensions are not densities!!!! Dimensions are strictly the result of the universal consciousness as manifested in the imagination sector of thought. Density means level of development as measured in terms of closeness to union with the one... Cycle. So, obviously, the "chupacabras" is a manifestation of human consciousness, and, human beings are a manifestation of the Chupacabras consciousness. Get it? Now, a shocker for you: You would not exist if someone didn't "dream you up."
Q: (L) Who dreamed me up?
A: Not important just yet. You literally are the "figments" of someone's imagination, and nothing more!!!
Q: (L) You mean God dreams and brings us into existence?
A: Remember, "God" is really all existence in creation, in other words, all consciousness. This is because all existence in creation is consciousness, and vice versa.
Q: (L) So, the issues of racial superiority that are brought up in the Urantia book can be answered by 'anything is
possible?'
A: Close, but remember, all there is -- is lessons!
A session with a crapload of people as guests, with the C's being pretty irritated and out of character at the beginning (osit), but I think the dream comment is really good food for thought.
 
Excellent, does that mean that:

1-Al Today invented another Al Today

2-They both exist simultaneously but they come aware of each other in one moment by the way of thinking on each other.

3-Maybe both of them don’t existed until the moment when they met?

Does anyone exist until someone imagines him? Can we imagine ourselves? Maybe we do it all the time when we are awake. What happens if that “someone" stops to dream about us? Can he stops dream about us?

So how many are Al Todays then?

Back to question 2. Is that what C’s said that all our realities will be merged on the realm border crossing? All Al Todays will become one 4D Al Today? Maybe more precisely in 4D there are less (in numbers) Al Todays then in 3D?Does other 3D Al Todays knows about wave and 4. density? If they don’t, will them be merged too?
 
That would fall into what's called a "what if" factor - parallel worlds. If we dreamt (or daydream) of us doing something that we would like to do or wish we did, our other "selves" in parallel worlds already did (or doing) that. So, once we hit the realm border crossing, we would have memories or experiences of doing these things that we dreamt up.

C's said:
You would not exist if someone didn't "dream you up."
That would implied that we are just imaginations of our real self from another 3D reality. Then again, which reality is real (in term of 3D)? Would it be possible that once we've merged, all of our realities, all of our imaginations, and parallel experiences...becomes one as we become 4D? That would make alot of sense.

Avala said:
1-Al Today invented another Al Today

2-They both exist simultaneously but they come aware of each other in one moment by the way of thinking on each other.

3-Maybe both of them don’t existed until the moment when they met?

Does anyone exist until someone imagines him? Can we imagine ourselves? Maybe we do it all the time when we are awake. What happens if that “someone" stops to dream about us? Can he stops dream about us?
Curious, but nobody ever really "stop" dreaming...maybe for a moment, but not at all the time. However, maybe we are dreams of a dreamer.
 
C's wrote: said:
You would not exist if someone didn't "dream you up."
I currently cannot disprove what the Cs said. My own thoughts are that we may indeed be dream selves of a higher consciousness. I can’t say that my dream self was given a brief existence by my consciousness, or that my dream self was a ‘visitor’ that came into the dream.
And I still seek answers for…

My dream self wondered about all those other people within the dream. Are they figments of my imagination, formulated for the dream, or are they ‘dream selves’ of other people?
Is it possible that the dream world is an alternate reality where dream selves of other people exist? Just like we could be dream selves of higher consciousness' that currently exist here on the BBM.

On the other hand, this dreaming experience could just be brain chemistry forming illusions.

Lot's of speculation can be had here. I really think we will find answers eventually. Opening the mind to all possiblities is what may be of utmost importance.

edit: Learning what to ask...
 
As for whatever/whoever is "dreaming us up" and the possibility of it waking up and stopping the dream, I think that's trying to interpret hyperdimensional realities with 3rd density linear-time perspective. I think it has to do with consciousness, and actualizing infinite potential creations by "dreaming them up", though I don't think the "dreamer" and the "dream" necessarily have anything to do with one another in terms of "time" or a co-dependence in the sense that if the dreamer "dies" or something, we'll all disappear. I dunno how it works hyperdimensionally and with respect to infinity, but one way it could work is if there is a co-dependence in the sense of having a dream and dreamers, but then we could be dreaming ourselves up, or we could be dreaming up the dreamer, and then if it wasn't for the dream, there would be no dreamer, and so you could say if the dream was to disappear, the dreamer, being a figment of the dream's imagination, would as well (which is counter-intuitive on 3d and makes little sense as it seems backwards, but again, the C's often talked about changing the past etc, so in that sense if the effect can literally affect its own cause, I don't see why a dream cannot "dream up" its own dreamer..). Though I don't think anyone "ceases to exist" like that, even if there is a co-dependence. He might not exist for the dream or dreamer, but doesn't mean he doesn't exist. Maybe kinda like "variability of physicality" where the C's said 4th density do not perceive our planet unless they choose to, so it doesn't exist for them until they choose to focus on the reality where our little planet does exist. Considering that there may be plenty of realities where our solar system exists but without Earth, or the whole solar system doesn't even exist either. But if somebody chooses to experience that, it doesn't make our solar system "disappear" and we'll all suddenly be gone - it just won't exist in the reality the being chooses to experience, though in a different reality (this one) we are just fine.

In that sense perhaps it's kinda similar to dreams, somebody dreams us up, but choosing not to dream does not "undo" the dream either, you can't just "uncreate" what exists, you can choose not to experience/perceive it, but as the C's have said, everything that can possibly exist, does. And yet at the same time, it's all "dreamed up" by something. Sure makes spaghetti of a linear mind, but it makes a certain kind of sense.. o_O
 
Zadius Sky said:
That would fall into what's called a "what if" factor - parallel worlds. If we dreamt (or daydream) of us doing something that we would like to do or wish we did, our other "selves" in parallel worlds already did (or doing) that. So, once we hit the realm border crossing, we would have memories or experiences of doing these things that we dreamt up.
And do we do what they like or wish to do? I think that in such case we will have memories of our other selves, but we will see it as our own memory because we will be one with them.

Zadius Sky said:
That would implied that we are just imaginations of our real self from another 3D reality. Then again, which reality is real (in term of 3D)? Would it be possible that once we've merged, all of our realities, all of our imaginations, and parallel experiences...becomes one as we become 4D? That would make alot of sense.
I think there is no “real" reality in 3D unless we (or whoever lives it) think that his reality is real.


Al Today said:
Is it possible that the dream world is an alternate reality where dream selves of other people exist? Just like we could be dream selves of higher consciousness' that currently exist here on the BBM.
Or we also can be dream selves of people in reality what we see as dream reality. You realize that you do exact what C’s have said about chupacabras? Your dream self is wondering about you/him and you are wondering about him/you.

The C’s also said that we are all one, and what if each one of us is just a thought of one being, just one his expression? By this came to my mind that they also said that the all knowledge that exist and everything that exist is already in everyone of us, so do our thoughts then live their lives in their realities, and wondering if there are other realities, but then we are really inventing ourselves and all that is through our thoughts.

Al Today said:
On the other hand, this dreaming experience could just be brain chemistry forming illusions.
Possibly, and I also think that we will see how all that works one day, but in the meanwhile it is interesting to play with it.


I would also love to comment Scio’s post which is inspiring to me, but unfortunately have no time now, must go.
 
I don't understand why the term chupacabras keeps popping up... Why does that other dream self need to be defined, or related to some evil goat sucking mythical beast? Can't that other self (faller) be a nice person, just as confused, or possibly curious as myself?
 
I think that that with chupacabras is just example taken to easily explain some ideas of other realities. Who says that you in other realities are not nice just as in this one? I really don’t think that other selves had to be defined (or that it is even possible) we even can’t define ourselves and of course that it is not connected with animal sucking beast.

It is just example, chupacabra gets aware of people because people gets aware of chupacabra, they are interconected.What I was telling; you became aware of your dream self when your dream self gets aware of you.

Am I again made some mistake in my English maybe? I am sorry if that’s the case.
 
ScioAgapeOmnis said:
In that sense perhaps it's kinda similar to dreams, somebody dreams us up, but choosing not to dream does not "undo" the dream either, you can't just "uncreate" what exists, you can choose not to experience/perceive it, but as the C's have said, everything that can possibly exist, does. And yet at the same time, it's all "dreamed up" by something. Sure makes spaghetti of a linear mind, but it makes a certain kind of sense...
A dreamer is a dream and a dream is a dreamer. A dream is always there, but might require a dreamer to manifest or appear. A dream is passive and a dreamer is active, so to say. We can choose to pick a dream, as it is our conscious choice. Nothing is impossible. Dreams always seem to struggle or perhaps meeting with our linear mind since our "educated by society" mind never would accept the abstract mind of a dream. I hope that would make sense, in a way.

Avala said:
I think there is no “real" reality in 3D unless we (or whoever lives it) think that his reality is real.
If we think that our own reality is real, then we would become ignorant and prisoners of our "real" reality. What really matters is our level of awareness. You never know...we might "pop" into a reality not of our own and never know it. Our level of awareness determines what is the difference between realities. If we are aware that there are other realities, existing of all possibilities, stems from our thoughts and dreams, we might have a better understanding, in a sense, that all realities exist, in order for us to exist as seekers.

Al Today said:
Opening the mind to all possiblities is what may be of utmost importance.
Very true...and we might need to be aware of all of those possibilities.

Avala said:
Who says that you in other realities are not nice just as in this one?
If we ever meet our "other selves," it will not be as we expected.
 
Just some thoughts, not for believing of course:

Consciousness is devoid of form, of substance, and can't really be found "directly" anywhere IN the universe - hence why if you open up a brain its nowhere to be found - but it is always there, we don't need to "find" it, because we are it - the scene of a brain being opened to find consciousness is happening "within" consciousness already, and so it is easy to see that its right here, and its not going anywhere. If you see something, experience something, it is happening within consciousness. It is this search for consciousness "out there" which can hide the fact that it is right here. It can't be found "out there", only the universe is out there (this applies to the outside of ALL living beings, and what they have "inside" them - inside meaning the turning around of the arrow of perception so that it goes past the mind and into the heart of consciousness). This might sound simple but its quite profound because that which is without form, the reflection of form, the balance of form and formless, is the OPPOSITE to form in every single way. Form has no will, it just "exists", and form can be split up into pieces and named. You can't do that with consciousness because it has no measurements, no dimensions etc. So everyone that you see is actually YOU, because consciousness cannot be divided. Its a paradox - you have done, you will do, and you are doing everything that everyone else is doing including yourself. At some point I will write a reply to myself on this forum, but I don't know what I'm going to say xD

Pretty much everything that we use to identify ourselves is usually a form of some sort, we identify ourselves by what is different about ourselves in comparison to everyone and everything else. But in reality there is no real difference, the only thing is: what you percieve and what you choose "now". The *percieved* differences are due to exactly that - the perception of the universe. Perceptions aren't part of consciousness but part of the universe, they are like locations which you can go to. The only thing consciousness does aside from "experiencing/observing" is choose directions. Like being on a river, it is consciousness that chooses out of the available choices which way to go. The river never goes anywhere, and the choices are still there once we have passed them, the lack of choices even give the impression of time passing, as we have no choice to go back. So, we aren't ever a "location", we aren't ever a human or a profession (ie. a doctor, a mechanic etc.), or a perception. Think back over a period of years and your profession changes, your body changes, your perception changes. What is left of when you now, from when you were one year old, amounts to pretty much nothing, maybe something but we have no way of knowing if that didn't come from something completely different. The point is that "identity" can be very much a subjective thing, it changes all the time and its only really us that keeps the whole thing together in our minds (choosing paths to locations which contain these beliefs as the scenary), instead of knowing the objective identity and seeing the subjective identities for what they are. If you ever faced a big change in your life, you can maybe see how what everyone would identify as "you" is actually two different people, its just that you look the same (or similar), have the same name etc.

So when it comes to dreams its not really any different. The dream self of yours is just "form". Everything in your dreams is just as real as everything that happens in the waking world, its just that theres more, and/or different meanings in the waking world, but basically they are just different "locations" in the same huge universe, they contain different things, different laws, different scenary really thats all - its as "connected" as choosing to watch some TV before you go to sleep - the choice is there as an option, which is available when "feeling tired" is part of the scenary.

If someone you know dies in a dream you would feel bad, but when you wake up you no longer care about that person who died, because they are still around in the waking life. You might say "oh but it was just a dream", but still, someone died - theres no difference there - but the differences are what feelings are there, what memories, what it means etc. Someone still died in their own way (but in dreams they can come back of course). Really the dream world is just different thats all, but its no less "real". When people die or get hurt in dreams, what makes it any different to what happens in the real world, apart from it might look a bit different, and that they can come back later? Its AS real as the waking world but doesn't usually fall into people's definition of real, because it doesn't have "long term effects" on either the waking world or the dream world, for "them" anyway.

The thing that unites the dream world with the waking world is consciousness - its the one thing that stays even though the two places - dream or awake - can be completely different. You can even be different people in your dream. After being lots of different people in different places, not even acting how you would act in the real world, it can change the perception in the waking world on what your identity is, and give more choices in the waking world due to the "option" of a change in perception.

And its not like this means there is definately an afterlife in the sense that we would remember our previous lives, since memories don't have to be there in order for consciousness to exist. Its not something which NEEDS an afterlife with memories to say we never die. Its complete *dettachment" to form, which doesn't mean you stop experiencing it, but it is acceptance that memories, experience - the whole "scene" from thought, to memories, to the planet, can change and there is one thing that is always the same - consciousness that experiences it all. If you believe you are the "items" in the scene, that are exclusive from everything else, then you will believe in death, but when you accept that they come and go (which is only due to limited perception anyway), and that you - the formless, non-exclusive - stays, you can focus less on "surviving" and more on what you want to focus on, seeing as no choice is going to "kill" you.

I think the C's, when they say, "you wouldn't exist unless someone dreamed you up", are talking about structure. I mean, the structure of connections, with relation to what choices can be made from wherever consciousness is. In other words, the way the universe is connected is "through" life and the connections are choices which life makes, and everything that exists, exists through consciousness, and so when they say "you" they mean the "form" of you - it seems to me that they're basically talking in a way which makes no sense, in order to make sense (using our own assumptions as a way of proving them wrong by using them in a situation where they cannot apply). I think they said it because "someone dreamed you up" implies that a seperate form dreamed you up even though forms do not dream, they ARE the dream, and so if a form dreams up a form, what dreams up that form that dreamt up the other form? Points to singular consciousness in my opinion, because if consciousness dreamt up a form, then it is merely in a chosen "location", and the perception of BEING this dreamt up form is the chosen location of the same consciousness before *or* after the previous (in this paragraph) location of consciousness (which was the choice to dream up the form that is being experienced by the same consciousness).

"My dream self wondered if my sleeping self could have multiple, simultaneous dreams with other selves. My dream self wondered about all those other people within the dream. Are they figments of my imagination, formulated for the dream, or are they ‘dream selves’ of other people?"

They could be more than one of those choices I think. It could be real people in a real city who really were alive and living full lives, beyond the boundries your dream. You could have been experiencing part of one of the inhabitants of that cities lives, and so they didn't "die" when you left, they didn't even notice any difference. When you were dreaming of being them, they thought they were just being themselves, but actually that portion of their lives would be remembered and written down in a forum in a completely different reality, by a different person xD And chances are someone is dreaming of reading this right now, and is having exactly the same experience as you, and will wake up, remember it, and write it down in a forum like this :D

"Wide awake now, I began to think about this 3D ‘life’, right ‘now’. Is this all a dream?"

I don't think so, I think its not "only" a dream but a memory of it can be perceived as a dream. But basically its just "what it is", IMO. Calling it a dream leaves out the fact that its a different kind of dream to what you have - its like a "hyper dream" (that our hyper-waking self is having). But I wouldn't get caught up in trying to name it like that, because at the same time as being a "hyper dream" it can be made up of many smaller dreams from many, many, different beings, even just imaginations. In the end though its just forms/sensate/objects which can be accessed by consciousness. Looking it like that is a more open minded approach IMO.
 
Al Today said:
My dream self came to realize that ‘it’ was in a dream. My dream self then wondered about my sleeping self. My dream self could ‘see/feel’ my sleeping self. My dream self tried to access, to communicate if you will, with my sleeping self. My sleeping self immediately woke up, wide eyed and feeling the presence/existence of my dream self. The intense feeling of being two(2) existing, separate, yet the same entity(ies) kinda sorta still sticks with me.
A couple of thoughts flitted through my mind, both on reading your post initially and again the second time around. The first thought was

1. Was the dream a 'screen' for some sort of alien interaction, for instance like an abduction?

and secondly

2. It kind of remided me a bit of 'The Matrix' movie. Two kinds of reality and one is hidden from the other.
 
If we be able (by some miracle) to base our perception on similarities more then differences can that make some bigger change, for example can we change our reality more easily? This just struck my mind, that’s how they do it in higher densities. And also on lower densities we are one, but to see that first we must see diferencies, and become aware both on differences and similarities and then again reunite, but this time with awareness what we are doing. Then really all is just one singular conciousness.But I think if we now can perhaps realize that, more “sense it" it is very indescribable for us on this level.
And all choices and number of choices we can choose depends just on our level of conciousness.Thats seems so easy and unbelievably reachable. So even in 3. density we are really live in all and extended presence, and we are so close to see that, its just that we must to learn how? And to learn seems so easy; we just must want to learn?

Is there a difference between dreams and memories that “actually happened" ? I can say “I have a memory of one event" but I can ( and I do, from time to time) also say “I have memory of one my dream" where only my perception of them can make difference what is dream and what is “real" memory?



Zadius Sky said:
If we think that our own reality is real, then we would become ignorant and prisoners of our "real" reality. What really matters is our level of awareness. You never know...we might "pop" into a reality not of our own and never know it. Our level of awareness determines what is the difference between realities. If we are aware that there are other realities, existing of all possibilities, stems from our thoughts and dreams, we might have a better understanding, in a sense, that all realities exist, in order for us to exist as seekers.
Maybe all realities where some sort of “ourselves" exist is ours own realities; it’s just that we cant perceive it all right now. But then there is a question is all our selves in all realities really are one being, or is it more “little" beings that will become one “bigger" being in 4D for example (in future)?


Zadius Sky said:
If we ever meet our "other selves," it will not be as we expected.
Why not? Maybe because of need for different experiences?
 
Russ said:
They could be more than one of those choices I think. It could be real people in a real city who really were alive and living full lives, beyond the boundries your dream. You could have been experiencing part of one of the inhabitants of that cities lives, and so they didn't "die" when you left, they didn't even notice any difference. When you were dreaming of being them, they thought they were just being themselves, but actually that portion of their lives would be remembered and written down in a forum in a completely different reality, by a different person xD And chances are someone is dreaming of reading this right now, and is having exactly the same experience as you, and will wake up, remember it, and write it down in a forum like this
It can be really everything, but this is excellent. :D So “their" Al Today is on the forum with other “us" then.Al Today can you ask please your dream self how we there are doing?
 
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