Another hit for the Cs - Cashless Society - VISA 666!

Joe

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Now where have I heard this predicted....Seems that this is the setup, all we need now is another REAL financial collapse to push it through early.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/banksandfinance/6968143/Is-a-cashless-society-on-the-cards.html

Is a cashless society on the cards?

Steve Perry, executive vice president of Visa Europe, says cash is expensive - a cost on society - and should be replaced by a cashless society.

Steve Perry, executive vice president of Visa Europe, has a different take on the folding stuff packed in our wallets that most of us take for granted. "Cash is expensive," he says. "We need to be using it less."

Expensive? Vintage wines, maybe. Designer clothes, yes. Modern art, almost certainly. But cash?

"Why do you think supermarkets introduced cashback?" Perry asks rhetorically.

He has me stumped there. I tell him I always thought of it as a service for overdrawn students to drive a few more sales through the tills.

"No," he responds politely. "It's because they want cash out of the system so there is less to manage. Processing a transaction on a card can be cheaper than handling cash."

Perry is a leading cheerleader for the cashless society. It's hardly a surprising role, but its an argument he is finding increasingly easy to make. Last month, for example, the Payments Council announced to anguished outrage that in 2018 the cheque would be dead.

"There are many more efficient ways of making payments than by paper in the 21st century, and the time is ripe for the economy as a whole to reap the benefits of its replacement," Paul Smee, chief executive of the Payments Council, said.

Perry extends the same argument to cash. Notes and coins are never going to be fully replaced, he accepts. Currency has, after all, been around in some form or another since 3,000BC. But now that we're in the electronic age, payments could do with a little catching up, he reckons.

Visa has recently published an extensive report on the cost of cash to society. Citing numerous independent papers by consultants and national governments, the payments company constructs a compelling case.

"The European Commission has calculated that the total cost to society of all payment methods including cash, cheques and payment cards equates to 2pc-3pc of GDP," the report states. "To put this figure into context, it should be remembered that the entire EU agricultural sector equates to 2.1pc of GDP, which means we spend more on payment than we produce on food."

The EC estimates that cash accounts for more than two-thirds of the total cost. McKinsey, the consultants, have estimated that "society spends about €200 (£180) a year per person to cover the cost of cash" and the "real" cost of cash to a retailer is 1.3pc of the purchase price – no less than the transaction fee on a card. The Dutch central bank has published a similar study, estimating the annual cost of cash at €300 per family.

Because cards are less risky (the associated cost is estimated at 0.02pc-0.1pc per transaction on cards compared with 0.1pc-0.2pc with cash) and encourage spending, they are more efficient and better value, Visa argues. Furthermore, card transaction fees are expected to fall, with some countries in Europe such as Denmark already offering free debit card services to retailers.

In the UK, Perry estimates, £1 in every £2.50 is spent on cards. He hopes to see the ratio reversed, with £2 in every £3 on cards by 2015. Of course, that would mean more business for Visa but, he claims, it would also mean less waste through cash security and cash handling costs.

A few years ago, changing consumer behaviour to such a degree would have been unthinkable. Perry says the internet and "chip and pin" have changed all that. Online retailers have helped the public grow familiar with card purchases, while chip and pin has reduced the incidence of fraud from 0.07pc to 0.05pc.

In the EU, according to the European Central Bank, €1.68 trillion was spent on cards in 2008 and use has been growing at 12pc a year for the past five years. Debit card spending this year in the UK is expected to overtake cash spending by value for the first time.

Perry believes the UK consumer is ready, citing the massive increase in the use of debit cards. Visa, best known for credit cards, now generates 70pc of its European business through debit cards.

Other countries are not so enlightened, he notes. Germany is still so nervous about card payments that some online retailers offer a service where they collect the cash at the customer's door on delivery. Others are more technologically savvy. South Korea introduced a preferential VAT treatment for consumers paying with cards to encourage the move to cheaper, cashless payments. Subsequently, the share of cash payments fell from 40pc in 2002 to 25pc in 2006.

For Visa, the challenge now is the 80pc of all transactions that are still made in cash – largely small ticket items such as newspapers and snacks. Visa has been pioneering contactless payments, that allow swift purchases by waving the card over a reader and dispensing with a pin – making buying with a card even more effortless than with cash.

Perry believes 2010 will be the year contactless takes off, with the total number of cards in use rising from 5m to 15m. Barclaycard has already 1m customers on its "onepulse" card.

Visa's new vision is to insert chips into mobile phones and do away with cards altogether. Antony Jenkins, chief executive of Barclays' global retail bank, already has a "onepulse" enabled phone and more prototypes are being trialled at Visa's innovations suite. The difficulty is persuading mobile phone manufacturers to build a handset that can store a chip and antennae.

Jenkins believes contactless mobile phones are the future and will open the door to fully mobile banking. Soon enough, people will be receiving, making and managing their payments on mobile phones, he reckons. In Africa, six million people are already paying for goods on their mobiles, proving that electronic payment systems can be more reliable and secure than cash.

Of course, cash will never be fully replaced. It's the currency of the black economy for a start, which is one reason why the authorities would like it used less and less. In Italy, for example, the black economy is estimated to be 40pc of GDP and 12pc in the UK. It's also proved remarkably adaptable over the past five millenia. For Visa, though, there is still ample room for cards.
 

knowledge_of_self

The Living Force
Re: Is a cashless society on the cards? Visa says yes, 666 times!

Perhaps this article should also be in "another hit for the C's" section!
 

Franco

Jedi Master
Re: Is a cashless society on the cards? Visa says yes, 666 times!

Interesting, I guess logically it would always move in this direction, at least in more advanced countries, the 3rd world would for sure struggle with a cashless society.

Credit card companies would have a scary amount of information on private individuals and this would probably push the black market on to trade or something else of value.
 

Nienna

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It's quite the "set-up" piece.

Tells those who have the cards how savvy they are. How those who don't use debit cards are backwards and unsavvy. How cash is soooooo inconvenient and expensive :rolleyes: and how much better off we all will be with a cashless society.

I've seen it coming for years, as I imagine you all have, what with the Visa commercials where everyone is boggying there way out of a store, everyone in sync like little automatons, until......one person either is spending cash or writing a check and everyone has to wait for the teller to return change or for the person writing the check to finish. This little piece of individuality is absolutely inconvenient for everyone else.

Also, I notice that they are saying how everyone will pay with their mobile phone. Sooooo if you don't have a cell phone, you won't be able to purchase anything and we know just how easy it is going to be to track everyone with a cell phone. So no RFID chip needed to be injected into the skin. That will probably come later as everyone is seeking still more convenience in this already over-convenient society, all the while our privacy slips away.
 

Scottie

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"Why do you think supermarkets introduced cashback?" Perry asks rhetorically.

He has me stumped there. I tell him I always thought of it as a service for overdrawn students to drive a few more sales through the tills.

"No," he responds politely. "It's because they want cash out of the system so there is less to manage. Processing a transaction on a card can be cheaper than handling cash."
Right... I'm sure that retailers just LOVE it when people purchase goods with credit/debit cards, and the card companies get a 2.5% cut of every sale (or whatever the current rate is).

Note he said, "...a card can be cheaper..." Well, I suppose you could argue that the armored truck that comes to carry the bucks off to the bank costs something, but I doubt it's anywhere near as much as the card companies take - especially for small businesses, who don't need the armored truck!
 

Eboard10

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
It is only a question of time before the digital currency will be put in place. It is also quite obvious when one thinks of all the paper that is being printed at the moment. Also, remember that all the problems behind the financial crisis lie in liquidity. The current currency system was IMO set up on purpose so that one day it would collapse on itself (a big Ponzi scheme so to speak) and that they could then impose their digital/cashless economy.

Many people talk about the NWO being the creation of one global borderless "country". However, what many don't realize is that the PTB don't need that, at least not in the near future. What matters nowadays is the money, the cash. Society depends on money. That's their top priority (which is of course not the Lizzies's...).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7sySuIXG_IM
 

Pierre

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Mr. Scott said:
Right... I'm sure that retailers just LOVE it when people purchase goods with credit/debit cards, and the card companies get a 2.5% cut of every sale (or whatever the current rate is).
And you have to add to this commission the credit card reading machine that costs several hundred euros
 

Beau

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Belibaste said:
And you have to add to this commission the credit card reading machine that costs several hundred euros
Not just that, but most businesses get charged for every transaction that occurs on credit/debit machines.
 

ALLusion

The Force is Strong With This One
It's comical how the logic always gets spinned right on its head with almost everything in this world. Isn't the reason for all this economic mess were in now mostly due to banks and their fantastic idea of the 'loan'? having a cashless society would only create MORE debt when people go over their credit limit, erasing credit cards, bank accounts, banks, and anything thats NOT hard cash (or energy) would surely be the more logical choice no?

I dream too much :zzz: just another inevitable fall into greater entropy for the human race, more homeless people, but no money to help them! :mad:
 

Avi

Jedi Council Member
Add to this the following excellent articles:

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/197099-GLD-ETF-Warning-Tungsten-Filled-Fake-Gold-Bars

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/200996-Fake-gold-bars-in-Bank-of-England-and-Fort-Knox

Seems that not only removing cash from society but the gold upon which it is supposedly based is also underway. Makes one wonder what kind of link exists between the disappearance of gold and the probability of incoming meteor impact with potential for worldwide catastrophe. If civilization were to survive such an event, the gold being hoarded makes a heavy-handed and monopolized ability to drive any economy which might remain, regardless of the shambles it might be in.

That is unless there were some way for society to entirely extricate itself from the grip of the evil moneychangers in the world. How wonderful it would be if the majority took a stance and said, enough! Fiat system of currency is hereby outlawed!

Sigh, wishful thinking....
 

dan22

A Disturbance in the Force
If we move to a cashless society it will be the biggest mistake central planners ever made.

The absence of cash will encourage the barter system, and as every well educated human being knows the natural evolution of a barter system results in a commodity based currency which eventually will be gold and/or silver! Once people will get used to using gold and silver as mediums of exchange the demand for the precious metals will skyrocket and their price will go through the roof, and that is before people will start to look at them as a store of value. A cashless society will kill the fiat paper system
_http://israelfinancialexpert.blogspot.com/2010/01/if-we-move-to-cashless-society-it-will.html
 

abstract

Dagobah Resident
"There are many more efficient ways of making payments than by paper in the 21st century, and the time is ripe for the economy as a whole to reap the benefits of its replacement,"
Yes, the economy will surely recover because we stop using cash,becase the problems are not because of the fraudulent banking system...f***ers.

Visa's new vision is to insert chips into mobile phones and do away with cards altogether.
Yeah, because my life revolves around my phone. GET REAL! Another way to track what we do.

I could go on and on, but I don't need to explain why this is all so messed up, at least not to the forumites.
 

Mike

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
dan22 said:
If we move to a cashless society it will be the biggest mistake central planners ever made.

The absence of cash will encourage the barter system, and as every well educated human being knows the natural evolution of a barter system results in a commodity based currency which eventually will be gold and/or silver! [..]
Welcome to the Forum, dan22. As is customary here, you can post an intro in the Newbies section and tell us a bit about yourself (no need for personal information).

Also, I think that if they did make the final move to a cashless society that they would outlaw the possession of gold and silver, much like they did in the 30's in the US and really crackdown on any type of black market. Barter would still happen, but I'm pretty sure the PTB have some plan waiting in the wings for any contingency, much like the appearance of the Patriot Act out of thin air.
 

Bluebird

The Force is Strong With This One
Currently only around 3-4% of money actually exists as notes and coin, the rest is just bits and bytes in computer databases, in other words doesn't exist. The international bankers have enslaved us with their system of fractional reserve lending ie. lend money that doesn't exist and then have the gall to charge interest on it. What a racket!!!

The bible actually says only those who have the mark of the beast shall buy or sell. Once the cashless society is enacted any one of us can be cut out of the system with a keystroke, we could not be paid, would be unable to buy food or other necessities unless we do exactly as instructed.

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/197099-GLD-ETF-Warning-Tungsten-Filled-Fake-Gold-Bars

http://www.sott.net/articles/show/200996-Fake-gold-bars-in-Bank-of-England-and-Fort-Knox
Heres something I've often wondered, supposing ET wants the gold on planet Earth, what better way than to allow humans to mine and process the gold deposits. ET then instruct their minions in control of the international banking system to buy up the gold using the aforementioned non existent money and have it stored in centralized repositories. At leisure, simply remove the gold and have it replaced by fake gold coated tungsten. The scam only gets discovered when someone mistakenly ships out the fake bars which actually get tested.

Cheers
 

Skyfarmr

Jedi Master
FOTCM Member
dan22 said:
The absence of cash will encourage the barter system, and as every well educated human being knows the natural evolution of a barter system results in a commodity based currency which eventually will be gold and/or silver!
Here, here,... the evolution of the barter system into the "paper currency" system was defined nicely in The Gods of Eden, by William Bramley.
Just as a reminder, in chapter titled Funny Money, Bramley writes about the inflatable paper money:
Inflatable paper money allows a handful of people to absorb and manipulate a great deal of true wealth, which are the valuable goods and services people produce, simply through the act of printing paper and slowly destroying the value of that paper with inflation. It causes money to become its own commodity which can be manipulated on its own terms, usually to the detriment of the production and barter system. Money was meant to assist that system, not to dominate and control it.

The new inflatable paper money system described above was the new "science" of money being installed by the Brotherhood revolutionaries....

[The creation of the Dutch Bank of Amsterdam which allowed the continuation of the Eighty Years War between Spain and Holland] by issuing notes four times in excess of the Bank's asset base.... reveals the primary reason why the inflatable paper money system was created: it enables nations to fight and prolong their wars. It also makes the human struggle of physical existence in a modern economy more difficult due to the massive debt and parasitic absorption of weatlh that the system causes. Furthermore, steady inflation further reduces value of people's money so that their accumulated wealth is gradually eroded. The Custodial aims expressed in The Garden of Eden and Tower of Babel stories were greatly furthered by the new paper money system.
...and it will be continued to be furthered by a cashless society...


Barter systems work with REAL goods and services AND will survive when the electricity goes out, or communication systems crash, but will require that you have gotten to know and trust others in your community with REAL goods and services to trade. (ie NETWORKING)
 
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