There are a lot of lies written here. I am from the city of Irpin. Childhood lived in Bucha. The Russian occupation found me in Nemeshaevo. Where did we manage to evacuate? I saw the Russians shelling Nemeshaevo when there were no Ukrainian troops there. After that I joined the militia as a volunteer. I haven't seen a single Nazi in my life. There is not a single Nazi in our battalion. We have never professed either racism or Nazism. After the Russians fled from Bucha, I visited there and I know from my relatives what happened there. I know from stories about Russian looting and robbery. I walked and watched the destruction in the city of Irpin where all the destruction was caused by shells from the location of the Russian troops. I will fight to the end, because Russian "denazification" simply means the destruction of us as a people and nationality.
Putin Recognizes Donbass Republics, Sends Russian Military to 'Denazify' Ukraine
- Thread starter bjorb
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You got it wrong, but hey good luck with your fighting. Could you share with us what you relatives told you about what "really" happened in Bucha? Were they living in Bucha at the time of the event?
Iggdrasil
Padawan Learner
Two servicemen of the Armed Forces of Ukraine, who surrendered to Russian troops in Kherson, asked not to be exchanged, as they do not want to return to the territories controlled by Kyiv, our correspondent reports.
They would like to stay and obtain Russian citizenship.
They would like to stay and obtain Russian citizenship.
Do you have any evidence to share about this? Or it's just anecdotal?
And what do you think about the years-long genocide in Donetsk? Plenty of evidence on that one.
The puppet government of 2014 even praised Nazi soldiers and worked very hard to promote the Western agenda, of course.
Really? That's odd... there are a whole lot of photos and videos of Ukrainian Nazi soldiers and civilians, and it's not just the "Azov Batallion". It seems like they are pretty open about it.
Ukrainian survivors and refugees are actually saying the opposite, that Ukrainian militants are looting, beating, and accusing resisting civilians. This has been reported since the Donbas genocide started.
And about Bucha:
Ukraine lost all sense of nationality and sovereignty from the very moment the US and NATO were allowed to start manipulating internal affairs and sponsoring the opposition to force a coup, destabilize the country, and put pressure on Russia.
Nothing new here: Color revolutions, sponsoring the opposition - including radical groups and terrorists - regime changes, false flags, blaming the enemy, and so on... all part of the old US/NATO playbook, again lots of evidence about it, even if they try to burry it under a lot of propaganda.
Kyiv's Forces Made Another Failed Attempt To Recapture Zmeinyy Island
On June 21, the Russian Defense Ministry reported that Kyiv’s forces had made another attempt to recapture Zmeinyy Island (Snake...
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KYIV’S FORCES MADE ANOTHER FAILED ATTEMPT TO RECAPTURE ZMEINYY ISLAND
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On June 21, the Russian Defense Ministry reported that Kyiv’s forces had made another attempt to recapture Zmeinyy Island (Snake Island) in the Black Sea.
The Russian side added that in responsie to these actions, the Russian Armed Forces launched Oniks cruise missiles at Shkolny military airfield near Odessa and destroyed hangars for Ukrainian Bayraktar-TB2 UAVs.
Additionally to this, Russian strikes hit the following targets:
Meanwhile, Russian forces continue launching attacks at military facilities located in Ukraine.
- 2 artillery plattoons of M777 155-mm howitzers have been destroyed in Kubansky island.
- Russian Aerospace Forces have destroyed 2 launching ramps of S-300 air defence missile system near Ochakov and Tuzla (Odessa region).
- High-precision air-based missiles have destroyed 4 munitions depots near Mirnaya Dolina, Loskutovka, Podlesnoye (Lugansk People’s Republic), as well as a Buk-M1air defence system near Seversk (Donetsk People’s Republic).
- In addition, manpower and military equipment of the Armed Forces of Ukraine (AFU), as well as of nationalist groups, including the Right Sector, have been neutralised near Belaya Gora, Novodruzhesk, Mirnaya Dolina, Podlesnoye and Volcheyarovka.
- Within counter-battery warfare towards Donetsk, 2 plattoons of Uragan multiple rocket launchers have been neutralised near Zaryanoye and Dimitrov, as well as 2 plattoons of Giatsint-B 152-mm howitzers at their firing positions near Spartak and Podgornoye.
- Operational-tactical and army aviation has neutralised: 57 manpower and military equipment concentration areas, 1 command post of the AFU, as well as a multi-function missile guidance radars of S-300 air defence system near Seversk (Donetsk People’s Republic).
I can't prove it with anything. I didn't take any photos. I didn't want to take pictures at all. We were blocked in the country. We were 9 adults and 6 children. I was concerned with survival. Around 7 am I went out on the porch. We were always on duty - listening to the cannonade, to hear if the shells were flying in our direction. I heard the distant sound of gunshots from the north side and after four or five seconds I heard a hiss in the air and deafening crackling explosions in the village. From the north, the Russians were advancing along the old Borodyanskaya highway to Bucha. This road near Borodyanka, going from the north, makes a turn east to Bucha, and Nemeshaevo is located to the south of the road. When the shelling began, in a panic we all hid in the basement. A few hours later, a column of Russian tanks drove into the village from the north. A few days later we decided to walk through the village. I did not take a mobile phone as we were told that the Russians were taking all the phones. One person was also killed who filmed the movement of tanks on the phone. Later, the Russians themselves announced that it was forbidden to shoot them and they would shoot without warning.
Genocide is a special destruction of people and not military action. You write only Russian propaganda here - but you absolutely do not want to hear refugees from Donetsk who fled to our side. And there are many such people. I will tell about one person from my platoon of volunteers. I didn't know him well yet. We (about ten) sat for a consultation with a psychiatrist. The psychiatrist taught that we are warriors and not rapists and executioners. If the Russians surrender, take them prisoner and do not mock them. And then I saw how this man's face turned purple. He quietly said "at least castrate." I then thought that maybe someone died here with him or he was not himself. And then a guy showed up and they started talking. They both ended up from Donetsk. I started asking about him. This man was a successful businessman, and the DNR people took away his business and all his property there and threw him into the "basement" demanding a ransom. Friends collected a ransom for him and he fled to Kyiv. That's why he really hated the Russians, although he himself seems to be Russian, he always spoke Russian. There are many refugees from Donbass here in Irpin and Bucha. According to the census, more than 15,000 people moved them.
Did he say why they closed his business and threw him in the basement? Maybe he was a traitor and had it coming? Him being still alive tells a story all of its own, doesn't it?
In Bucha, artillery shelling was only on a column of tanks on Vokzalnaya Street. Yes, a dozen houses were destroyed there. No Russian positions in other quarters among the houses were fired upon. I walked and looked. All other destruction was originally the result of defense and street clashes. All this time my older brother and mother remained in Bucha. My brother saw where Russian howitzers were firing at Irpen. But this is not about the people who died in the shelling, but about those people who were killed from firearms. The Russians checked all the houses. They had lists of servicemen. If a soldier was caught, he was executed. There was an officer's house on the next street. He was not there, and then the Russians simply shot at his house from a tank. There were also random killings. On the street where my mother lives, Russians driving by in an armored car shot at a man standing on the porch of the house and killed him. The Russians did nothing wrong to my mother and brother. When my mother's house was searched, she told the Russian officer (he was very polite) - "run away from here or they will kill you." The officer replied that he had no choice. If he deserts, his own people will kill him, and he has a small child. Therefore, I will not argue that all Russians are bad.
Nazism is an ideology. We do not have an ideology of intolerance towards other races or nationalities. No one teaches to hate either by race or by nationality. We began to hate only Russians. We hate empires, we hate kings or Fuhrers. This is our trouble - we never have common leaders. The leader must be crystal clear to please everyone. We are more anarchists. About Azov, I know that there were some Nazi founders who trained soldiers. "Division of Misanthropes". There were about ten of them. But they are all long dead. Soldiers go to Azov not because of ideology, but because of patriotism. The oath in Azov is a prayer to the Madonna, for the city of Mariupol was founded in honor of Mary. This is Russian propaganda - show a photo of ten people and announce that we are all like that. I do not deny the existence of skinheads some 20 years ago - then, after watching Western films, it was very fashionable to be a skinhead. Walk around with a shaved head. Make skinhead tattoos. I saw skinheads then. Someone a couple of years ago drew a skinhead sign in our yard - but this is not a state ideology. This is not taught in schools.
Ask the Russians what happened during the time after the collapse of the USSR? When the streets were ruled by robbers "racketeers"? This man was simply robbed, taking everything from him. He is alive because he was given a ransom!
As you can recognize in this 338 pages thread, anecdotical accounts alone do not help to clarify a complex matter and even less if they are opposed to a significant amount of substantiated information. Also, they can be emotionally charged and used to manipulate people into believing lies. It's similar to the US/NATO propaganda... mostly emotionally charged lies, and no evidence, yet, the western mass media and paid bots in social networks have ensured to share it far and wide, and quite dramatically, so that people that have trouble thinking for themselves believe them.
What's interesting is that most of what you have shared so far is a carbon copy of the Western propaganda we have been reading and watching since the conflict began... Russia did it! Russia is evil! Nothing about Ukrainian forces shooting or bombing civilians... And even the Nazis are good! Heroes protecting their homeland. It's a script, and the template for it is very old. Yes, there have been a few cases of abuse by particular pathological elements of Russian forces, but they pale in comparison with what the Ukrainian forces have done to their soldiers, Russian soldiers, and the civilian population.
What's interesting is that most of what you have shared so far is a carbon copy of the Western propaganda we have been reading and watching since the conflict began... Russia did it! Russia is evil! Nothing about Ukrainian forces shooting or bombing civilians... And even the Nazis are good! Heroes protecting their homeland. It's a script, and the template for it is very old. Yes, there have been a few cases of abuse by particular pathological elements of Russian forces, but they pale in comparison with what the Ukrainian forces have done to their soldiers, Russian soldiers, and the civilian population.
В моем городе (Ирпень) большинство ненавидело Януковича. О каком перевороте может идти речь - если это было просто восстание. Переворот невозможен, если население поддерживает правительство. Мне лично Янукович не нравился, хотя участия не принимал.
I'm on vacation now. Since volunteers of territorial associations are not sent to the front. We will enter the battle if there is an attack on us again. I have already said in previous posts that my mother and older brother were in Bucha all this time. Since the beginning of the occupation in Bucha, electricity and heating have disappeared. Therefore, my brother and I called up only at certain times in order to save phone charges. The brother is an engineer and later built a wind farm for electricity. We started calling more often. First there were street fights. Ukrainian soldiers on vehicles broke through and pursued the Russians, or vice versa. Then, by mid-March, it subsided, and he heard only artillery skirmishes. My brother had to serve the whole street where he lives. There are elderly people who cannot go for food. There were abandoned dogs that he fed. Together with several, he guarded the market from marauders at night. The Russians took what they wanted for free in this market. He saw how an armored car drove up to a closed supermarket and the Russians, having shot the doors with guns, plundered the supermarket. When the Russians fled at night, he heard. Early in the morning I called my godfather, and they went to check if everyone was alive and well along their streets. It was his godfather who discovered six dead people in the basement (you should have seen these photos). They did not see how people died during the occupation. Because they did not go to the area where there was a massacre. My brother went there only once, and when he saw the corpse of a man on the street, he did not go there again.
I am not lying. I don't have to lie. If you think that I'm lying, then I wish you yourself to be in a similar situation.
AzarHyun
Jedi
The right time to get to know Mr. Putin better. This biography book is readable, informative, balanced. Unfortunately, it does not cover the period of the last 10 years, but it will give you an exceptional insight into where Vladimir Putin came from, his family, social and political background. Insight into the exceptional character and key events up to 2012. Good and honest ratings on Amazon. Recommendation, maybe for the beach if you have the courage ..
Putin: Hutchins, Chris, Korobko, Alexander: 9781780881140: Books - Amazon
Putin: Hutchins, Chris, Korobko, Alexander: 9781780881140: Books - Amazon
www.amazon.com