Work on 'Self-Love' by 'active reasoning'

I thought the following article by Gurdjieff can be beneficial to share to work on 'self-importance', 'self-referencing', 'Internal & External Considering' and understanding 'Narcissism' from a different perspective. I think this approach is colinear to Cs/Laura's "Love is Light is Knowledge" understanding also (described in here).


[quote author=Gurdjieff Views-From-the-Real-World p266-270]
Liberation leads to liberation

These are the first words of truth—not truth in quotation marks but truth in the real meaning of the word; truth which is not merely theoretical, not simply a word, but truth that can be realized in practice. The meaning behind these words may be explained as follows:

By liberation is meant the liberation which is the aim of all schools, all religions, at all times. This liberation can indeed be very great. All men desire it and strive after it. But it cannot be attained without the first liberation, a lesser liberation. The great liberation is liberation from influences outside us. The lesser liberation is liberation from influences within us.

At first, for beginners, this lesser liberation appears to be very great, for a beginner depends very little on external influences. Only a man who has already become free of inner influences falls under external influences.

Inner influences prevent a man from falling under external influences. Maybe it is for the best. Inner influences and inner slavery come from many varied sources and many independent factors—independent in that sometimes it is one thing and sometimes another, for we have many enemies.

There are so many of these enemies that life would not be long enough to struggle with each of them and free ourselves from each one separately. So we must find a method, a line of work, which will enable us simultaneously to destroy the greatest possible number of enemies within us from which these influences come.

I said that we have many independent enemies, but the chief and most active are vanity and self-love. One teaching even calls them representatives and messengers of the devil himself.

For some reason they are also called Mrs. Vanity and Mr. Self-Love.

As I have said, there are many enemies. I have mentioned only these two as the most fundamental. At the moment it is hard to enumerate them all. It would be difficult to work on each of them directly and specifically, and it would take too much time since there are so many. So we have to deal with them indirectly in order to free ourselves from several at once.

These representatives of the devil stand unceasingly at the threshold which separates us from the outside, and prevent not only good but also bad external influences from entering. Thus they have a good side as well as a bad side.

For a man who wishes to discriminate among the influences he receives, it is an advantage to have these watchmen. But if a man wishes all influences to enter, no matter what they may be—for it is impossible to select only the good ones—he must liberate himself as much as possible, and finally altogether, from these watchmen, whom some consider undesirable.

For this there are many methods, and a great number of means. Personally I would advise you to try freeing yourselves and to do so without unnecessary theorizing, by simple reasoning, active reasoning, with yourselves.

Through active reasoning this is possible, but if anyone does not succeed, if he fails to do so by this method, there are no other means for what is to follow. Take, for instance, self-love, which occupies almost half of our time and our life. If someone, or something, has wounded our self-love from outside, then, not only at that moment but for a long time afterwards, its momentum closes all the doors, and therefore shuts out life.

When I am connected with outside, I live. If I live only inside myself, it is not life; but everybody lives thus. When I examine myself, I connect myself with the outside.

For instance, now I sit here. M. is here and also K. We live together. M. called me a fool—I am offended. K. gave me a scornful look—1 am offended. I consider, I am hurt and shall not calm down and come to myself for a long time.

All people are so affected, all have similar experiences the whole time. One experience subsides, but no sooner has it subsided than another of the same nature starts. Our machinery is so arranged that there are no separate places where different things can be experienced simultaneously.

We have only one place for our psychic experiences. And so if this place is occupied with such experiences as these, there can be no question of our having the experiences we desire.

And if certain attainments or liberations are supposed to bring us to certain experiences, they will not do so if things remain as they are.

M. called me a fool. Why should I be offended? Such things do not hurt me, so I don't take offense—not because I have no self-love; maybe I have more self-love than anyone here.

Maybe it is this very self-love that does not let me be offended.

I think, I reason in a way exactly the reverse of the usual way. He called me a fool. Must he necessarily be wise? He himself may be a fool or a lunatic. One cannot demand wisdom from a child. I cannot expect wisdom from him. His reasoning was foolish. Either someone has said something to him about me, or he has formed his own foolish opinion that I am a fool—so much the worse for him. I know that I am not a fool, so it does not offend me. If a fool has called me a fool, I am not affected inside.

But if in a given instance I was a fool and am called a fool, I am not hurt, because my task is not to be a fool; I assume this to be everyone's aim. So he reminds me, helps me to realize that I am a fool and acted foolishly. I shall think about it and perhaps not act foolishly next time. So, in either case I am not hurt.

K. gave me a scornful look. It does not offend me. On the contrary, I feel sorry for him because of the dirty look he gave me. For a dirty look must have a reason behind it. Can he have such a reason?

I know myself. I can judge from my knowledge of myself.

He gave me a dirty look. Possibly someone had told him something that made him form a bad opinion of me. I am sorry for him because he is so much a slave that he looks at me through other people's eyes. This proves that he is not. He is a slave and so he cannot hurt me.

I say all this as an example of reasoning.

Actually, the secret and the cause of all such things lies in the fact that we do not possess ourselves nor do we possess genuine self-love. Self-love is a great thing. If we consider self-love, as we generally understand it, as reprehensible, then it follows that true self-love—which, unfortunately, we do not possess—is desirable and necessary.

Self-love is a sign of a high opinion of oneself. If a man has this self-love it proves what he is.

As we have said earlier, self-love is a representative of the devil; it is our chief enemy, the main brake to our aspirations and our achievements. Self-love is the principal weapon of the representative of hell.

But self-love is an attribute of the soul. By self-love one can discern the spirit. Self-love indicates and proves that a given man is a particle of heaven. Self-love is I—I is God. Therefore it is desirable to have self-love.

Self-love is hell, and self-love is heaven. These two, bearing the same name, are outwardly alike, but totally different and opposite to one another in essence. But if we look superficially, we can go on looking throughout our whole life without ever distinguishing the one from the other.

There exists a saying: "He who has self-love is halfway to freedom." Yet, among those sitting here, everyone is full to overflowing with self-love. And in spite of the fact that we are full to the brim with self-love, we have not yet attained one tiny bit of freedom. Our aim must be to have self-love. If we have self-love, by this very fact we shall become free of many enemies in us. We can even become free of these principal ones—Mr. Self-Love and Mrs. Vanity.

How to distinguish between one kind of self-love and another? We have said that on the surface it is very difficult.

This is so even when we look at others; when we look at ourselves it is still more difficult.

Thank God we, who are sitting here, are safe from confusing the one with the other. We are lucky! Genuine self-love is to tally absent, so there is nothing to confuse.

In the beginning of the lecture I used the words "active reasoning."

Active reasoning is learned by practice; it should be practiced long and in many varied ways.
[/quote]


added: 'Internal & External Considering'

Re: Work on 'Self-Love' by 'active resoning'

The following part is the quote form Boris Mouravieff: Polar Opposites, or the Fifth Way of Love by Laura Knight-Jadczyk that I think 'colinear' to the G's 'active resoning' toward real 'Self-Love':

Q: (L) How can you tell the difference between instinctive knowledge and emotional reactions?

A: Emotions involve wishful thinking, instincts are "gut feelings," psychic in nature, and are stronger. When it is wishful thinking, there is always psychic instinct seeping through which you can access if you use reason and examine your lessons of the past.

Q: (L) Is it also correct that emotion can be used to mislead, that is emotions that are twisted and generated strictly from the flesh or false programming?

A: Emotion that limits is an impediment to progress. Emotion is also necessary to make progress in 3rd density. It is natural. When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density.

Q: (L) What about Love?

A: What about it?

Q: (L) There are many teachings that are promulgated that Love is the key, the answer. They say that illumination and knowledge and what-not can all be achieved through love.
A: The problem is not the term "love," the problem is the interpretation of the term. Those on third density have a tendency to confuse the issue horribly. After all, they confuse many things as love. When the actual definition of love as you know it is not correct either. It is not necessarily a feeling that one has that can also be interpreted as an emotion, but rather, as we have told you before, the essence of light which is knowledge is love, and this has been corrupted when it is said that love leads to illumination. Love is Light is Knowledge. Love makes no sense when common definitions are used as they are in your environment. To love you must know. And to know is to have light. And to have light is to love. And to have knowledge is to love.

Click to expand...

(emphasis are mine)

Thanks for posting this gotogo,

I found the first section very information. It gave me a different perspective on internal reactions to outside conflicts. But I do have a question regarding the session that you posted.

the C's say:
"When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density."

I've had problems understanding this in the past and still can't seem to mentally grasp what is being said here. What does this mean in practical terms?

Are limiting emotions, emotions that are generated from wishful thinking?

And what does "based on assumptions from emotions" mean?

Andrew said:

the C's say:
"When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density."

I've had problems understanding this in the past and still can't seem to mentally grasp what is being said here. What does this mean in practical terms?

Are limiting emotions, emotions that are generated from wishful thinking?

And what does "based on assumptions from emotions" mean?

Click to expand...

My reading of the 'from emotions' in that sentence is that it is the second part of 'when you begin to separate' - so it's not 'based on assumptions from emotions' - it's 'limiting emotions based on assumptions' - you need to separate those limiting emotions, which are based on assumptions, from true emotions which open one to unlimited possibilities.

Limiting emotions are those that are based on assumptions, not objective reality - usually those based of fear/inhibition/anticipation/expectation/desire - mindsets that limit possibilities and thinking - at least this is my understanding.

Andrew said:

"When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density."

I've had problems understanding this in the past and still can't seem to mentally grasp what is being said here. What does this mean in practical terms?

Click to expand...

There is a lot of meaning in that quote, for sure!

In practical terms, it may be useful to deal with the first part first. Have you ever had the experience of questioning you assumptions in a given situation and found your assumption(s) to be incorrect? After realizing the error(s), did a given emotional issue clear up?

In short, it refers to reacting from emotions - emotion-based thinking and behavior.

When you come to see this as a mechanical process that is the reverse of the natural flow - emotions resulting from appropriate actions, you may see unlimited possibilities for increasing your understanding of a given issue where you previously thought you already had the correct understanding.

You are straightening out your mind, preparing for the next density level of consciousness.

OSIT

So acting from your emotions, based on 'assumptions', of what you 'think' is true/may be true, is in essense subjective, therefore 'limiting' in the sense of what can otherwise be experieced objectively?

I.E. Unlimited possibilities if you were to not act from this mechanical behavior and sought to see reality objectively.

This being a mechanical process makes a lot of sense and can be seen through simple observation of not only oneself, but other people as well.

Does this sound about right with what has been said here?

That's why there's a lot of meaning there. It's a principle that has wide application, it seems.

Andrew said:

So acting from your emotions, based on 'assumptions', of what you 'think' is true/may be true, is in essense subjective, therefore 'limiting' in the sense of what can otherwise be experieced objectively?

Click to expand...

I think that's it. It may be more powerful to say that acting from your emotions is in essense, error.

A trick is to discern acting from emotion that one is using as a 'cause' or rationalization/justification/identification. As opposed to acting while experiencing particular emotions.

A rather mundane example:
If you think your spouse is looking at another man/woman and that means you're not 'good enough' or adequate, or loved, or whatever, doesn't that limit your ability to understand something about that spouse that you don't know - only assume? Also, having accepted the erroneous assumptions, you limit your ability to understand the workings of your own mind, as well.

Didn't your previous assumptions about life limit your ability to understand hyperdimensional reality concepts, etc?

Andrew said:

So acting from your emotions, based on 'assumptions', of what you 'think' is true/may be true, is in essense subjective, therefore 'limiting' in the sense of what can otherwise be experieced objectively?

I.E. Unlimited possibilities if you were to not act from this mechanical behavior and sought to see reality objectively.

This being a mechanical process makes a lot of sense and can be seen through simple observation of not only oneself, but other people as well.

Does this sound about right with what has been said here?

Click to expand...

Pretty much, though I have a different understanding than Buddy. I would add that they are also suggesting the importance of an active, 'unlimited' emotional center - one not clouded by assumptions and running programs. The emotional center is key to development and most people's emotional center is so shut down, twisted or stunted from a lifetime of dreaming and conforming to what amounts to a pathological reality that they can't really do much at all when it comes to 'transformation' or the Work, as we call it. Once one begins to be able to separate these limiting emotions, based on assumptions, from emotions that actually open one up to the other possibilities (within oneself and in the world and the Universe) everything changes. It is the power in that - in those emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities that they seem to be focusing on. This is why cleansing and awakening the emotional center is so vitally important and why Eiriu Eolas is so, potentially, powerful and beneficial.

anart said:

Once one begins to be able to separate these limiting emotions, based on assumptions, from emotions that actually open one up to the other possibilities (within oneself and in the world and the Universe) everything changes. It is the power in that - in those emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities...

Click to expand...

I like your explanation better (as usual :)). My current understanding of that second part has to do with emotions that come from successes in the Work - the confirmations that you're acting appropriately to life in given situations - the 'fuel for the work', so to speak. It's powerful motivation to keep going and expanding your limits.

I know I still have much Work to do...but learning is fun!

Thanks for a very interesting thread. I will comment based on my understanding of the correct work of centers. I welcome critique of this understanding as I primarily arrived at it based on my reading Gurdjieff and Mouravieff. I have been using this framework to comprehend the role of the breathing exercises and psychopathology in this esoteric work. A networked examination of the following comment are welcomed, as I often misunderstand important concepts.

Buddy said:

Andrew said:

So acting from your emotions, based on 'assumptions', of what you 'think' is true/may be true, is in essense subjective, therefore 'limiting' in the sense of what can otherwise be experieced objectively?

Click to expand...

I think that's it. It may be more powerful to say that acting from your emotions is in essense, error.

Click to expand...

Emotions can arise in the thinking center. These are subjective—subject to programming of ideals, expectations, fears, resentments, etc. Actions based on these emotions are, so to speak, in error. However, emotions arising in the emotional center, whether negative or positive are an objective apprehension of reality.

Thinking can likewise arise in the emotional center of man or woman. Action based on this emotional thinking is subject to error. A first step on the Way is to purify the functions of the centers. The reasoning function must originate and be preformed by the intellectual center. The emotions must originate and be experienced in the emotional center.

Then, one actively reasons upon an event, with the intellectual center and experiences the event with the emotions separate from reasoning and the real “I” decides and ACTS based upon information arising from the two distinct functions.

Anart said:

This is why cleansing and awakening the emotional center is so vitally important and why Eiriu Eolas is so, potentially, powerful and beneficial.

Click to expand...

The higher emotional center arises from the purified and active lower emotional center.
The higher intellectual center forms from the higher emotional center.
Is this the correct sequence and what we call “growing a soul”?

Hi go2, I would say that you are certainly very close to my personal understanding of it, with a few exceptions. It is not my understanding that just because an emotion is fueled by the energy of the emotional center (what you term 'arising from') means that it is objective - UNLESS the emotional center has already been purified and has made and sustained a connection with the higher emotional center. It's rather a 'garbage in/garbage out' situation - even emotions that do not result from the usurpation of the energy of other centers can still be 'distorted' if one hasn't cleared up all the emotional issues that have accumulated over a lifetime of programming.

Also,

go2 said:

The higher emotional center arises from the purified and active lower emotional center.
The higher intellectual center forms from the higher emotional center.
Is this the correct sequence and what we call “growing a soul”?

Click to expand...

It is my understanding that in those individuals with a 'seed of a soul' the higher centers are already in existence and fully functioning - the issue is to purify the lower centers (fuse a singular I) in order for them to properly connect to and interact with the higher centers. It's rather like those who are sleeping or just beginning to awaken lack the equipment to connect to those aspects of themselves that basically are the 'seed of a soul' - until they fuse a magnetic center/singular I that can interface with them. That's an awkward analogy, but hopefully it makes a little bit of sense.

I think it can be useful to quote the following part of ISOTM:

Ouspensky - In Search of the Miraculous p201-202] [b]The emotional center can work with 'hydrogen' 12. In reality said:

I found the first section very information. It gave me a different perspective on internal reactions to outside conflicts. But I do have a question regarding the session that you posted.

the C's say:
"When you begin to separate limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density."

I've had problems understanding this in the past and still can't seem to mentally grasp what is being said here. What does this mean in practical terms?

Are limiting emotions, emotions that are generated from wishful thinking?

And what does "based on assumptions from emotions" mean?

Click to expand...

"in practical terms":
1. examine the taste of mi12 by accumulated efforts of "self-remembering"
2. then see the difference between when 'the emotional center' works with mi12 and when 'the emotional center' works ('wrongly' BUT this is how usually people experience their emotions) with si12 (to my understanding this is when "Emotions involve wishful thinking") or lower substances

From my observations, when there are accumulated mi12 inside, emotions can be free from "assumptions" because this substance can work as the force that 'hold' "horse" (I posted a smiler observation here).

And to my understanding, it is this force (substance mi12) with which we can 'separate' "limiting emotions based on assumptions from emotions that open one to unlimited possibilities, that means you are preparing for the next density", and where 'active reasoning' from 'the (slowest) intellectual center' becomes possible (I am referring the 'speed' problem as anart pointed out at this post)

Same as others, I am also exploring the connection to "Eiriu Eolas" like this post. But for that, I now think something is missing in ISOTM :(, which I suspect the impact of Wave approaching at this point in time as Cs hinted:
[quote author=Session 30 May 2009]
Q: (L) In other words, there's no hope for our planet or our species if normal human beings do not come together and get over these varied pathological belief systems and religions and "your truth" and "my truth" and all that sort of thing?

A: Yes. All of that was created and spread by pathological types under the influence of their hyperdimensional masters for the purpose of turning this planet into a "hell on earth" with them as the masters. They have succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. What is needed is for many people to begin to make direct connections with their higher centers. This has been done via the "work" up to now, but there are other methods to accelerate the process and obtain the needed assistance.
[/quote]

(thank you for reading a long post ;))
edit: clarification

I just realized the discussion on this thread so far can be summarized by the following 2 lines of 'The Prayer of the Soul' !

Cleanse my heart
That I may know and love

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And the whole context of 'The Prayer of the Soul' is in the Remembrance of "Divine Cosmic Mind", which means "Self-Remembering" to my understanding.

(Well, this was a short version! :))


Edit: took out BOLD

In this context, maybe the connection of

Cleanse my heart
that I may know and love
the Holiness of True Existence

Click to expand...

with

Oh Divine Cosmic Mind,
Holy Awareness in All Creation

Click to expand...

gives and adequate perspective :)

Hello mkrnhr,

Are you saying:

the Holiness of True Existence

Click to expand...

and

Oh Divine Cosmic Mind,
Holy Awareness in All Creation

Click to expand...

are specifically addressing "Self-Remembering"?
Ummm, it could be.

My point when I added:

And the whole context of 'The Prayer of the Soul' is in the Remembrance of "Divine Cosmic Mind", which means "Self-Remembering" to my understanding.

Click to expand...

was that each line of "the Player of Soul" is sang in the the Remembrance of "Divine Cosmic Mind" so I took that as "Self-Remembering" without specifying any lines.
(just for clarification :))