Traits of Confident People

Laura

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stellar said:
Laura said:
Embracing the behaviors of confident people is a great way to increase your odds for success, which, in turn, will lead to more confidence. The science is clear; now you just have to decide to act on it.

_https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/critical-things-confident-people-wont-do-dr-travis-bradberry

And another thing that I think that didn't sit with me too well was the comment that it seems all about success which in my mind is subjective. The confident behaviour that may bring a feeling of success to one may be the opposite or unimportant to others. What is the intent of the wanted success and the ripple affect from it is more what I would consider.

Furthermore when someone uses the statement 'the science is clear' I just think "really? Todays 'science' has shown to be anything but clear" especially considering how ponerised so many scientists are and their studies.

Since you have so many objections to the piece perhaps you would like to share your own prescription for getting on in life effectively? Do you have a system? Does it work? Are your relationships with others successful? Are you a good obyvatel? What are your accomplishments?
 

T.C.

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stellar said:
This quote for the most part left me with having a taste of arrogance about it with no room for empathy or consideration; almost mechanical thought patterns. FWIW

I think I understand what you mean. That this kind of person is more free of neuroses. That the quote might easily to apply to an organic portal, or 'exterior man' or a primitively integrated type person; the kind of person who 'fits' in this world and isn't racked by any sort of angst, despair, depression, self-questioning; whose inner world is stable.

I guess such people who might be automatically like this may be effective at achieving their goals, but what kind of goals would be the question. Through their self-confidence, they might get their degree, find a high-paying job, start a family and do a good job of taking care of them, be a useful member of society, etc.

But perhaps someone for whom this kind of self-confidence has had to be worked at and with a personality they've had to work hard at might be more concerned with aims of a less exterior and prescribed nature, and more geared towards deeper, or greater, or 'higher' ideals due to a richer experience of life.

That maybe the first type of person has a solid belief system, but their beliefs may be less objective, whereas the latter type of person acts from a belief system that is more based in objective reality.
 
stellar said:
The latter part of your reply is close to how I perceive the authors definition. For one example "They don't wait for permission to act" indicates a presumption of knowledge that could very likely be based on the individuals perception not necessarily the objective truth.

This part is more related to the specific context of this "confident people profile", that is to say, "how to have a promotion". This part clearly refer to a context where the person is within an hierarchical structure (typicaly : at job). If you want a promotion, this is indeed what you have to do in some case (in others, this the best way to be fired). Like all american "personnal development" theory, this profile is created according the common american culture* and values (what i call american culture).

stellar said:
And another thing that I think that didn't sit with me too well was the comment that it seems all about success which in my mind is subjective. The confident behaviour that may bring a feeling of success to one may be the opposite or unimportant to others. What is the intent of the wanted success and the ripple affect from it is more what I would consider.

Again, this is the typical american* way of thinking... having a goal (being ambitious), then being successful... The subliminal value is "being a winer or stay a loser". As you noticed, the "success", except if it is a pratical ponctual goal (light a fire, escalading a mountain without dying frozen, etc.) is a pure relative to social values you embed. But not only that: To being successful, you must have a goal to achieve... if you have no precise goal, "success or failure" is not a relevant question.

stellar said:
Furthermore when someone uses the statement 'the science is clear'

It is a commercial argument, as for toothpaste, shampoo or laundry detergent :lol: Yes, logicaly, you have more chance to succeed something if your are confident, optimistic and if you try again and again until you succeed, than if you are depressive, you do not try or if you gives up at the first try... but you don't need "The Science" to understand that.

stellar said:
Maybe I'm off, I don't know... but the whole definition as it is presented just seems lacking some kind of human factor.

What happen is that you have noticed, but without precisely understanding it, the american culture substrate (winner culture, strugle for life, competition, and commercial arguments), which maybe enter into conflict with some of your values and way to "see the life". This profile is interesting, but is simplistic. It must be relativised and taken as a an american cultural* (what i call american culture*) perspective, which is not universal.


* if you are american, replace "american culture" by "anglo-saxon christian protestant capitalist software"
 

luc

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Interesting that some people 'instinctively' rejected some of this, or even the general idea. I had similar thoughts running through my mind when I read it. But you know what? All that is just a lame narrative to mask the fact that I'm NOT CAPABLE of some of the things outlined above (yet). But this doesn't change the fact that these are exactly the skills we need to be effective in this world, to live at a higher level of BEING.

You can lament on the cruelness of the business world, complain about psychopaths and character-disturbed people and generally criticise everyone who has some stamina and success. OR you can get yourself together and start becoming STRONG - in being, in character, in life.


ADDED: One thing to keep in mind I think is that such tips are not intended for psychopaths, narcissists and the like - they don't need such things at all. It is intended to help US neurotics become more confident, raise our level of being, and make a difference in this world.
 
luc said:
But this doesn't change the fact that these are exactly the skills we need to be effective in this world, to live at a higher level of BEING.

To be "effective in this world" probably... but to "live at a higher level of BEING", i would be less affirmative...
 

Menna

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These comments are funny I know that we are on an esoteric forum but Laura is talking about a specific topic within an esoteric forum. Please separate the two. Take the post as the post and relate it to your life. Everyone knows what confidence is can you taste it in each of the traits... Why does the word subjective or objective come up? No one is talking about the traits or breaking them down.
 

Laura

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sedenion said:
luc said:
But this doesn't change the fact that these are exactly the skills we need to be effective in this world, to live at a higher level of BEING.

To be "effective in this world" probably... but to "live at a higher level of BEING", i would be less affirmative...

To be effective in this world is what people inclined to serve others NEED desperately to study.

Really think about the following:

Life is religion. Life experiences reflect how one interacts with God. Those who are asleep are those of little faith in terms of their interaction with the creation. Some people think that the world exists for them to overcome or ignore or shut out. For those individuals, the world will cease. They will become exactly what they give to life. They will become merely a dream in the "past." People who pay strict attention to objective reality right and left, become the reality of the "Future." -- Cassiopaeans, 09-28-02

And take it in concert with "External Considering":

"The opposite of internal considering and what is in part a means of fighting against it is external considering. External considering is based upon an entirely different relationship towards people than internal considering. It is adaptation towards people, to their understanding, to their requirements. By considering externally a man does that which makes life easy for other people and for himself. External considering requires a knowledge of men, an understanding of their tastes, habits, and prejudices. At the same time external considering requires a great power over oneself, a great control over oneself. Very often a man desires sincerely to express or somehow or other show to another man what he really thinks of him or feels about him. And if he is a weak man he will of course give way to this desire and afterwards justify himself and say that he did not want to lie, did not want to pretend, he wanted to be sincere. Then he convinces himself that it was the other man's fault. He really wanted to consider him, even to give way to him, not to quarrel, and so on. But the other man did not at all want to consider him so that nothing could be done with him. It very often happens that a man begins with a blessing and ends with a curse. He begins by deciding not to consider and afterwards blames other people for not considering him. This is an example of how external considering passes into internal considering. But if a man really remembers himself he understands that another man is a machine just as he is himself. And then he will enter into his position, he will put himself in his place, and he will be really able to understand and feel what another man thinks and feels. If he can do this his work becomes easier for him. But if he approaches a man with his own requirements nothing except new internal considering can ever be obtained from it.

"Right external considering is very important in the work. It often happens that people who understand very well the necessity of external considering in life do not understand the necessity of external considering in the work; they decide that just because they are in the work they have the right not to consider. Whereas in reality, in the work, that is, for a man's own successful work, ten times more external considering is necessary than in life, because only external considering on his part shows his valuation of the work and his understanding of the work; and success in the work is always proportional to the valuation and understanding of it. Remember that work cannot begin and cannot proceed on a level lower than that of the obyvatel, that is, on a level lower than ordinary life. This is a very important principle which, for some reason or other, is very easily forgotten."

Also, "super efforts":

"What is meant by a super-effort?" someone asked.

"It means an effort beyond the effort that is necessary to achieve a given purpose," said G.

"Imagine that I have been walking all day and am very tired. The weather is bad, it is raining and cold. In the evening I arrive home. I have walked, perhaps, twenty-five miles. In the house there is supper; it is warm and pleasant. But, instead of sitting down to supper, I go out into the rain again and decide to walk another two miles along the road and then return home. This would be a super-effort. While I was going home it was simply an effort and this does not count. I was on my way home, the cold, hunger, the rain—all this made me walk. In the other case I walk because I myself decide to do so. This kind of super-effort becomes still more difficult when I do not decide upon it myself but obey a teacher who at an unexpected moment requires from me to make fresh efforts when I have decided that efforts for the day are over.

"Another form of super-effort is carrying out any kind of work at a faster rate than is called for by the nature of this work. You are doing something—well, let us say, you are washing up or chopping wood. You have an hour's work. Do it in half an hour—this will be a super-effort.

"But in actual practice a man can never bring himself to make super-efforts consecutively or for a long time; to do this another person's will is necessary which would have no pity and which would have method.

"If a man were able to work on himself everything would be very simple and schools would be unnecessary. But he cannot, and the reasons for this lie very deep in his nature. I will leave for the moment his insincerity with himself, the perpetual lies he tells himself, and so on, and take only the division of the centers. This alone makes independent work on himself impossible for a man. You must understand that the three principal centers, the thinking, the emotional, and the moving, are connected together and, In a normal man, they are always working in unison. This unison is what presents the chief difficulty in work on oneself. What is meant by this unison? It means that a definite work of the thinking center is connected with a definite work of the emotional and moving centers—that is to say, that a certain kind of thought is inevitably connected with a certain kind of emotion (or mental state) and with a certain kind of movement (or posture); and one evokes the other, that is, a certain kind of emotion (or mental state) evokes certain movements or postures and certain thoughts, and a certain kind of movement or posture evokes certain emotions or mental states, and so forth. Everything is connected and one thing cannot exist without another thing.

"Now imagine that a man decides to think in a new way. But he feels in the old way. Imagine that he dislikes R." He pointed to one of those present. "This dislike of R. immediately arouses old thoughts and he forgets his decision to think in a new way. Or let us suppose that he is accustomed to smoking cigarettes while he is thinking—this is a moving habit. He decides to think in a new way. He begins to smoke a cigarette and thinks in the old way without noticing it. The habitual movement of lighting a cigarette has turned his thoughts round to the old tune. You must remember that a man can never break this accordance by himself. Another man's will is necessary, and a stick is necessary. All that a man who wants to work on himself can do at a certain stage of his work is to obey. He can do nothing by himself.

"More than anything else he needs constant supervision and observation. He cannot observe himself constantly. Then he needs definite rules the fulfillment of which needs, in the first place, a certain kind of self-remembering and which, in the second place, helps in the struggle with habits. A man cannot do all this by himself. In life everything is always arranged far too comfortably for man to work. In a school a man finds himself among other people who are not of his own choosing and with whom perhaps it is very difficult to live and work, and usually in uncomfortable and unaccustomed conditions. This creates tension between, him and the others. And this tension is also indispensable because it gradually chips away his sharp angles.

"But theories exist," said one of us, "that a man ought to develop the spiritual and moral side of his nature and that if he attains results in this direction there will be no obstacles on the part of the body. Is this possible or not?"

"Both yes and no," said G. "The whole point is in the 'if.' If a man attains perfection of a moral and spiritual nature without hindrance on the part of the body, the body will not interfere with further achievements. But unfortunately this never occurs because the body interferes at the first step, interferes by its automatism, its attachment to habits, and chiefly by its wrong functioning. If the development of the moral and spiritual nature without interference on the part of the body is theoretically possible, it is possible only in the case of an ideal functioning of the body. And who is able to say that his body functions ideally?

"And besides there is deception in the very words 'moral' and 'spiritual' themselves. I have often enough explained before that in speaking of machines one cannot begin with their 'morality' or their 'spirituality,' but that one must begin with their mechanicalness and the laws governing this mechanicalness. The being of man number one, number two, and number three is the being of machines which are able to cease being machines but which have not ceased being machines."
 

Beau

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luc said:
Interesting that some people 'instinctively' rejected some of this, or even the general idea. I had similar thoughts running through my mind when I read it. But you know what? All that is just a lame narrative to mask the fact that I'm NOT CAPABLE of some of the things outlined above (yet). But this doesn't change the fact that these are exactly the skills we need to be effective in this world, to live at a higher level of BEING.

You can lament on the cruelness of the business world, complain about psychopaths and character-disturbed people and generally criticise everyone who has some stamina and success. OR you can get yourself together and start becoming STRONG - in being, in character, in life.

I think that's quite spot on Luc. One can choose to look at these traits from a black-and-white perspective and see them as negative, selfish, narcissistic, etc. But I think that choosing a more nuanced way of looking at it is more objective and also cuts through what you mention above, the narratives that one creates to reject the traits. From a Work point of view, if one has an aim and is acting with external consideration and awareness, all of these traits can be used to benefit the individual in their life, whether it's in the work field or in interpersonal relationships. For example, not waiting for permission to act. That could be perceived negatively, and could actually be a negative trait from one perspective. But acting that way from a Work POV, it could be seen as entirely different and be turned into a positive trait. I think that applies to all the traits mentioned. It comes down to one's awareness and willingness to apply super-efforts to accomplish what they want in life. Seems to me the people who react negatively to this story due so because they don't see the inherent benefit in applying these concepts to their lives while keeping in mind the larger AIM and working to stay aware and in consideration of others in their actions.
 

Laura

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Okay, what I am going to do here in order to try to help some of you to SEE something important is use myself as an example.

They don’t make excuses. If there’s one trait confident people have in spades, it’s self-efficacy—the belief that they can make things happen. It’s about having an internal locus of control rather than an external one. That’s why you won’t hear confident people blaming traffic for making them late or an unfair boss for their failure to get a promotion. Confident people don’t make excuses, because they believe they’re in control of their own lives.

If I didn't have this trait, none of the things that bring people together here would even exist. There would be no Cs experiment, no website, no organizations, no communities, no SOTT - NOTHING. I could have made excuses not to do any of these things... at all stages. To me, making excuses is worse than weakness, it's waste. And there are few things I dislike more than waste.

They don’t quit. Confident people don’t give up the first time something goes wrong. They see both problems and failures as obstacles to overcome rather than impenetrable barriers to success. That doesn’t mean, however, that they keep trying the same thing over and over. One of the first things confident people do when something goes wrong is to figure out why it went wrong and how they can prevent it the next time.

Can you even imagine what I've gone through to keep this work going? And how many times I was so battered that quitting seemed like "peace"?

They don’t wait for permission to act. Confident people don’t need somebody to tell them what to do or when to do it. They don’t waste time asking themselves questions like “Can I?” or “Should I?” If they ask themselves anything, it’s “Why wouldn’t I?” Whether it’s running a meeting when the chairperson doesn’t show up or going the extra mile to solve a customer’s problem, it doesn’t even occur to them to wait for somebody else to take care of it. They see what needs to be done, and they do it.

If I had been waiting for permission from someone to do all the things I've done that have led, step by step, to what we have today - which isn't tiny potatoes anymore (more like small becoming medium) - nothing would ever have been done. In fact, we have often had to go against the accepted way and norm. Doing what is RIGHT, telling the truth in a world of lies, is a revolutionary act.

They don’t seek attention. People are turned off by those who are desperate for attention. Confident people know that being yourself is much more effective than trying to prove that you’re important. People catch on to your attitude quickly and are more attracted to the right attitude than what, or how many, people you know. Confident people always seem to bring the right attitude. Confident people are masters of attention diffusion. When they’re receiving attention for an accomplishment, they quickly shift the focus to all the people who worked hard to help get them there. They don’t crave approval or praise because they draw their self-worth from within.

I don't think that anyone can accuse me of seeking personal attention because, in fact, I don't like it and don't want it. I do what I have to do for The Work and sometimes that means attention is focused on me; but it's almost painful because I am really a private person.

They don’t need constant praise. Have you ever been around somebody who constantly needs to hear how great he or she is? Confident people don’t do that. It goes back to that internal locus of control. They don’t think that their success is dependent on other people’s approval, and they understand that no matter how well they perform, there’s always going to be somebody out there offering nothing but criticism. Confident people also know that the kind of confidence that’s dependent on praise from other people isn’t really confidence at all; it’s narcissism.

See above. I am happiest when I am facilitating others to do things and receive their just due.

They don’t put things off. Why do people procrastinate? Sometimes it’s simply because they’re lazy. A lot of times, though, it’s because they’re afraid—that is, afraid of change, failure, or maybe even success. Confident people don’t put things off. Because they believe in themselves and expect that their actions will lead them closer to their goals, they don’t sit around waiting for the right time or the perfect circumstances. They know that today is the only time that matters. If they think it’s not the right time, they make it the right time.

Usually, I'm doing something as soon as I have thought it through; but in other ways I do tend to put off very difficult jobs. I have to work on this.

They don’t pass judgment. Confident people don’t pass judgment on others because they know that everyone has something to offer, and they don’t need to take other people down a notch in order to feel good about themselves. Comparing yourself to other people is limiting. Confident people don’t waste time sizing people up and worrying about whether or not they measure up to everyone they meet.

On the above point, there is variance for us here because of the kind of work we do. However, a more nuanced way to think of this is that we don't put anyone down if we know they are trying to their best ability.

They don’t avoid conflict. Confident people don’t see conflict as something to be avoided at all costs; they see it as something to manage effectively. They don’t go along to get along, even when that means having uncomfortable conversations or making unpleasant decisions. They know that conflict is part of life and that they can’t avoid it without cheating themselves out of the good stuff, too.

This one has been a steep learning curve for me because I always dreaded confrontation and conflict. Now, I don't avoid it, but I still don't like it.

They don’t let a lack of resources get in their way. Confident people don’t get thrown off course just because they don’t have the right title, the right staff, or the money to make things happen. Either they find a way to get what they need, or they figure out how to get by without it.

I would say that this is one of my greatest strengths, though I could be wrong. I've always felt that if you have an idea, and the will and energy, you can do something with what you have: make what you have do until you can do better. See also what I wrote about waste above under "making excuses". Letting a lack of resources stop you from doing things is equivalent to making excuses about why nothing can be done. I don't believe that. I've said from the beginning, if all you see is darkness, BECOME the candle.

They don’t get too comfortable. Confident people understand that getting too comfortable is the mortal enemy of achieving their goals. That’s because they know that comfort leads to complacency, and complacency leads to stagnation. When they start feeling comfortable, they take that as a big red flag and start pushing their boundaries again so that they can continue to grow as both a person and a professional. They understand that a little discomfort is a good thing.

This is another of my strengths: If we aren't learning and growing, we are standing still and being static is death. If nothing is happening positive, believe me, I can stir it up.

Now, the thing about all of the above is that I'm not "confident" in a showy kind of way that you might associate with narcissism or psychopathy. I simply have an AIM and feel the compelling drive to move toward that AIM, and I am constantly scanning myself and my environment for ways to take another incremental step.

One thing that underlies all of the above, I think, is WILL TO BE and DO. The trait that comes close to this is the "not quitting".

Anyway, I hope this has given ya'll something to think about.
 

RedFox

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Beau said:
luc said:
Interesting that some people 'instinctively' rejected some of this, or even the general idea. I had similar thoughts running through my mind when I read it. But you know what? All that is just a lame narrative to mask the fact that I'm NOT CAPABLE of some of the things outlined above (yet). But this doesn't change the fact that these are exactly the skills we need to be effective in this world, to live at a higher level of BEING.

You can lament on the cruelness of the business world, complain about psychopaths and character-disturbed people and generally criticise everyone who has some stamina and success. OR you can get yourself together and start becoming STRONG - in being, in character, in life.

I think that's quite spot on Luc. One can choose to look at these traits from a black-and-white perspective and see them as negative, selfish, narcissistic, etc. But I think that choosing a more nuanced way of looking at it is more objective and also cuts through what you mention above, the narratives that one creates to reject the traits. From a Work point of view, if one has an aim and is acting with external consideration and awareness, all of these traits can be used to benefit the individual in their life, whether it's in the work field or in interpersonal relationships. For example, not waiting for permission to act. That could be perceived negatively, and could actually be a negative trait from one perspective. But acting that way from a Work POV, it could be seen as entirely different and be turned into a positive trait. I think that applies to all the traits mentioned. It comes down to one's awareness and willingness to apply super-efforts to accomplish what they want in life. Seems to me the people who react negatively to this story due so because they don't see the inherent benefit in applying these concepts to their lives while keeping in mind the larger AIM and working to stay aware and in consideration of others in their actions.

I can look back and see I would have reacted negatively to such an article in the past, associating it instantly with all that is wrong with the world (traits of narcissists/psychopaths) - but that isn't thinking about or assessing it, just an automatic programmed responce.
Something that may be of use when attempting to pin down an AIM is that of a 'happy life' vs a meaningful life.
Viktor Frankl, psychologist and Holocaust survivor: The difference between a happy life and a meaningful one
"It is the very pursuit of happiness that thwarts happiness."
That is, as human we are biases to favour comfortable familiar behaviour and thoughts - acting automatically/mechanically. Which leads to (mechanical) suffering.
Anything that doesn't fit with this bubble is thrown out in the blink of an eye, with no thought involved at all.

As he saw in the camps, those who found meaning even in the most horrendous circumstances were far more resilient to suffering than those who did not. "Everything can be taken from a man but one thing," Frankl wrote in Man's Search for Meaning, "the last of the human freedoms — to choose one's attitude in any given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way."

Frankl worked as a therapist in the camps, and in his book, he gives the example of two suicidal inmates he encountered there. Like many others in the camps, these two men were hopeless and thought that there was nothing more to expect from life, nothing to live for.

"In both cases," Frankl writes, "it was a question of getting them to realize that life was still expecting something from them; something in the future was expected of them." For one man, it was his young child, who was then living in a foreign country. For the other, a scientist, it was a series of books that he needed to finish. Frankl writes:
This uniqueness and singleness which distinguishes each individual and gives a meaning to his existence has a bearing on creative work as much as it does on human love. When the impossibility of replacing a person is realized, it allows the responsibility which a man has for his existence and its continuance to appear in all its magnitude. A man who becomes conscious of the responsibility he bears toward a human being who affectionately waits for him, or to an unfinished work, will never be able to throw away his life. He knows the "why" for his existence, and will be able to bear almost any "how."
[..]
How do the happy life and the meaningful life differ? Happiness, they found, is about feeling good. {Feeling good can simply mean acting mechanically, despite the suffering it brings} Specifically, the researchers found that people who are happy tend to think that life is easy, they are in good physical health, and they are able to buy the things that they need and want. While not having enough money decreases how happy and meaningful you consider your life to be, it has a much greater impact on happiness. The happy life is also defined by a lack of stress or worry.

Most importantly from a social perspective, the pursuit of happiness is associated with selfish behavior—being, as mentioned, a "taker" rather than a "giver."

The psychologists give an evolutionary explanation for this: happiness is about drive reduction. If you have a need or a desire — like hunger — you satisfy it, and that makes you happy. People become happy, in other words, when they get what they want. Humans, then, are not the only ones who can feel happy. Animals have needs and drives, too, and when those drives are satisfied, animals also feel happy, the researchers point out.

"Happy people get a lot of joy from receiving benefits from others while people leading meaningful lives get a lot of joy from giving to others," explained Kathleen Vohs, one of the authors of the study, in a recent presentation at the University of Pennsylvania. In other words, meaning transcends the self while happiness is all about giving the self what it wants. People who have high meaning in their lives are more likely to help others in need. "If anything, pure happiness is linked to not helping others in need," the researchers, which include Stanford University's Jennifer Aaker and Emily Garbinsky, write.

What sets human beings apart from animals is not the pursuit of happiness, which occurs all across the natural world, but the pursuit of meaning, which is unique to humans
[..]

So an AIM is important, a meaning to (your personal) existence.
Being a good obyvatel could be someones current goal (a step toward a bigger AIM), perhaps a better goal would to be the best obyvatel possible! Being confident as defined in this thread then would be skills that can be practiced and learned in the service of that goal (and the overall AIM).

So if someone finds themself rejecting the idea of being a confident person, perhaps take some time to really stop and ask what your AIM is.
Are you happy at your current level of existence? What is meaningful beyond automatically serving the self?
 

ashu

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Laura said:
Anyway, I hope this has given ya'll something to think about.

Thank you for breaking this down Laura. Much appreciated. Right off to print it out and read it again.
 

Gawan

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Imo these confident quotes are definitely worth keeping in mind and not only that, but to apply them in daily life. There are many situations to throw the towel, to live in peace and what not. If there are such situations it is helpful and in combination with what is written about confident peoples traits to have an aim and to stick to it. I didn't perceive them as narcissistic rather they are practical and useful in day to day business, of course many of these traits need to be practiced and some are not easy.

And thanks Laura for breaking them further down. Much to ponder.
 

Chu

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For me, these traits describe a Warrior very well, in the sense that we understand it here and based on Castaneda's but also Gurdieff's and Laura's writings. "Confidence" (the mere word itself), has been used in all kinds of contexts, and that's why some of you may be reacting to it (unless you are missing the point of these traits altogether).

As a description of a Warrior, with an Aim, they are traits worthy of development and nourishment, in my opinion.

They don’t make excuses. If there’s one trait confident people have in spades, it’s self-efficacy—the belief that they can make things happen. It’s about having an internal locus of control rather than an external one. That’s why you won’t hear confident people blaming traffic for making them late or an unfair boss for their failure to get a promotion. Confident people don’t make excuses, because they believe they’re in control of their own lives.

That's a warrior-like trait. It's about taking responsibility, being in charge. Doing what is right, and fighting against fears. Knowing that it's not the circumstances of your life that determine who you are, but rather what you Do with them.

They don’t quit. Confident people don’t give up the first time something goes wrong. They see both problems and failures as obstacles to overcome rather than impenetrable barriers to success. That doesn’t mean, however, that they keep trying the same thing over and over. One of the first things confident people do when something goes wrong is to figure out why it went wrong and how they can prevent it the next time.

That's a warrior-like trait. That is learning from mistakes, and acting not because one is not afraid, but in spite of that fear. A psychopath, on the contrary, can't seem to learn much from mistakes, and is not afraid. Now, some of us are slower learners than others, and we might try the same mistake a few times before learning. But the point is not to quit!

They don’t wait for permission to act. Confident people don’t need somebody to tell them what to do or when to do it. They don’t waste time asking themselves questions like “Can I?” or “Should I?” If they ask themselves anything, it’s “Why wouldn’t I?” Whether it’s running a meeting when the chairperson doesn’t show up or going the extra mile to solve a customer’s problem, it doesn’t even occur to them to wait for somebody else to take care of it. They see what needs to be done, and they do it.

That's a warrior-like trait. The most important part being the last sentence: doing what needs to be done. Seeing where help is needed, and acting on it. Acting in spite of our fears, and not wanting for someone to tell us what to do is hard. But then, that's when we do some things that are worthy in life. Of course, there is also external considering, and knowing ourselves well enough to know when we aren't competent enough in one area, or which blind-spots we have. But asking for help and guidance based on that knowledge is different from being dependent on external instructions and validation. It is trusting and seeing things as they are. The wrong kind of confidence in this case is believing in our own illusions and lies, and covering up our "brave acts" with narratives, not checking yourself, not asking for feedback. That's not warrior-like, it's ego and silliness.

They don’t seek attention. People are turned off by those who are desperate for attention. Confident people know that being yourself is much more effective than trying to prove that you’re important. People catch on to your attitude quickly and are more attracted to the right attitude than what, or how many, people you know. Confident people always seem to bring the right attitude. Confident people are masters of attention diffusion. When they’re receiving attention for an accomplishment, they quickly shift the focus to all the people who worked hard to help get them there. They don’t crave approval or praise because they draw their self-worth from within.

That's a warrior-like trait. It is about not having an external stick to measure ourselves with, when knowing that with our limitations and all, we do our best, and being able to nurture others by giving them the proper validation when they have done something good. It is also part of struggling with the Predator, because seeking the validation explained above is feeding and manipulative.

They don’t need constant praise. Have you ever been around somebody who constantly needs to hear how great he or she is? Confident people don’t do that. It goes back to that internal locus of control. They don’t think that their success is dependent on other people’s approval, and they understand that no matter how well they perform, there’s always going to be somebody out there offering nothing but criticism. Confident people also know that the kind of confidence that’s dependent on praise from other people isn’t really confidence at all; it’s narcissism.

That's a warrior-like trait. It takes bravery to do something even in the face of attacks. It takes bravery to do something because it's right, no matter the outsiders' view of it. Letting our narcissism run the show is dangerous, hurtful to others and not warrior-like. Most people are walking wounded, looking for that constant praise. And see which state the world is at because of that?

They don’t put things off. Why do people procrastinate? Sometimes it’s simply because they’re lazy. A lot of times, though, it’s because they’re afraid—that is, afraid of change, failure, or maybe even success. Confident people don’t put things off. Because they believe in themselves and expect that their actions will lead them closer to their goals, they don’t sit around waiting for the right time or the perfect circumstances. They know that today is the only time that matters. If they think it’s not the right time, they make it the right time.

That's a warrior-like trait. Again, acting in spite of fear, and making superefforts. Also learning to live in the Present, and enjoying the process. Knowing that today could be the last day of our lives, and acting as if what we do could be the last thing we do. Knowing that each step counts, no matter how small.

They don’t pass judgment. Confident people don’t pass judgment on others because they know that everyone has something to offer, and they don’t need to take other people down a notch in order to feel good about themselves. Comparing yourself to other people is limiting. Confident people don’t waste time sizing people up and worrying about whether or not they measure up to everyone they meet.

That's a warrior-like trait. Here I think that as an addition, not passing judgment is also a trait of someone who, like a Warrior, has gone through "the fire", and knows how darn hard some lessons are. Therefore, he or she stops criticizing others, because they know what the other people are going through. One might not agree with their choices, but one also knows that making a different choice is extremely hard, and has sympathy for that. Only very few people would choose otherwise, and remembering that helps with not judging.

The process of mirroring is different from judgment, because it is done for the specific purpose of reaching the higher self of the individual being mirrored, and (as much as humanly possible) without any identification, as outside observers and with care and respect for the True Self.

They don’t avoid conflict. Confident people don’t see conflict as something to be avoided at all costs; they see it as something to manage effectively. They don’t go along to get along, even when that means having uncomfortable conversations or making unpleasant decisions. They know that conflict is part of life and that they can’t avoid it without cheating themselves out of the good stuff, too.

That's a warrior-like trait. Especially in the context of the Work, we know how important friction can be for learning. That's friction within. But also, with the right type of networking and trust that comes with it, uncomfortable conversations (mirrors) and making unpleasant decisions (going against the Predator), are crucial for growing. On needs a warrior-like attitude to change things even when they hurt the smaller parts of oneself. No pain, no gain.

They don’t let a lack of resources get in their way. Confident people don’t get thrown off course just because they don’t have the right title, the right staff, or the money to make things happen. Either they find a way to get what they need, or they figure out how to get by without it.

That's a warrior-like trait. On a more psychological sense, it also means not letting our limitations, our realizations, overcome us to the point where we quit. No matter how flawed we are, where we are at at the start, and the mistakes we have made, we can ALWAYS do better and learn more. Those who blame their circumstances or their lack of this or that, never grow.

They don’t get too comfortable. Confident people understand that getting too comfortable is the mortal enemy of achieving their goals. That’s because they know that comfort leads to complacency, and complacency leads to stagnation. When they start feeling comfortable, they take that as a big red flag and start pushing their boundaries again so that they can continue to grow as both a person and a professional. They understand that a little discomfort is a good thing.

That's a warrior-like trait Superefforts, friction, etc. Without that, we wouldn't advance at all. It's not letting ourselves fall asleep so easily.

I found this to be a very useful text. I see areas where I need to develop those traits more, others where I'm not that bad (I hope!) but I can still improve. Most of all, I see it as a platform that can help remember oneself, go past fears and insecurities, and make life a "success", not by the standard definition, but what we can achieve as "Warriors-in process".

Yes, some of those traits are shared by psychopaths and corporate guys, but don't ignore the different goals and motivations. Don't ignore the factor of acting in spite of fears (which psychopaths tend to lack at a deeper level). Don't ignore the power of guilt, when it motivates us to do better because it's right (another thing psychopaths can't do). Don't ignore that some of those traits can help someone else's life, this forum being an example. Don't ignore that those traits can be used for good or bad, as with everything. Don't ignore that, when you have an Aim, then those warrior-traits are very much needed in order to make something happen. You can ignore it as "corporate talk", or you can take inspiration from it, I think.

Anyway, I'm sure a lot more can be said about each trait, so, a big FWIW.
 

luc

Ambassador
Ambassador
FOTCM Member
Fwiw, here are a few further thoughts on the traits:

They don’t make excuses. If there’s one trait confident people have in spades, it’s self-efficacy—the belief that they can make things happen. It’s about having an internal locus of control rather than an external one. That’s why you won’t hear confident people blaming traffic for making them late or an unfair boss for their failure to get a promotion. Confident people don’t make excuses, because they believe they’re in control of their own lives.

This means going hard against our mechanical inclination to 'look good' and to always look at our own role in events first. I got stuck in a traffic jam? Well, I could have started earlier - traffic jams are very likely, after all. "I'm really sorry I was late, I miscalculated my journey. Sorry." Hard!

They don’t quit. Confident people don’t give up the first time something goes wrong. They see both problems and failures as obstacles to overcome rather than impenetrable barriers to success. That doesn’t mean, however, that they keep trying the same thing over and over. One of the first things confident people do when something goes wrong is to figure out why it went wrong and how they can prevent it the next time.

Going against our mechanical reaction of throwing tantrums instead of just pushing through. Also, knowing that right after we start something worthwhile and difficult, our minds will try to talk us out of it. Persisting without obsessing and being ready to read the signs of reality, which can sometimes mean we need to adjust course.

They don’t wait for permission to act. Confident people don’t need somebody to tell them what to do or when to do it. They don’t waste time asking themselves questions like “Can I?” or “Should I?” If they ask themselves anything, it’s “Why wouldn’t I?” Whether it’s running a meeting when the chairperson doesn’t show up or going the extra mile to solve a customer’s problem, it doesn’t even occur to them to wait for somebody else to take care of it. They see what needs to be done, and they do it.

Discovering what is in you to do, what you have to give to the world, and then doing it, no matter the internal and external resistance. No one can tell you what it is and you don't need an authority to give their blessing. However, opening up to other people/networking about such things is very important in my experience.

They don’t seek attention. People are turned off by those who are desperate for attention. Confident people know that being yourself is much more effective than trying to prove that you’re important. People catch on to your attitude quickly and are more attracted to the right attitude than what, or how many, people you know. Confident people always seem to bring the right attitude. Confident people are masters of attention diffusion. When they’re receiving attention for an accomplishment, they quickly shift the focus to all the people who worked hard to help get them there. They don’t crave approval or praise because they draw their self-worth from within.

Not giving in to the urge to 'look good'. Having the courage to speak truthfully/be yourself, even if it makes you more vulnerable and some people will think badly of you. But by hiding behind a mask and pleasing people to get 'positive attention', we sin against our souls.

They don’t need constant praise. Have you ever been around somebody who constantly needs to hear how great he or she is? Confident people don’t do that. It goes back to that internal locus of control. They don’t think that their success is dependent on other people’s approval, and they understand that no matter how well they perform, there’s always going to be somebody out there offering nothing but criticism. Confident people also know that the kind of confidence that’s dependent on praise from other people isn’t really confidence at all; it’s narcissism.

We need to show other people by how we act that we don't need praise. Ironically, real praise will come more often that way in my experience. We should make constant efforts to DO things just because we think it's right, not because we are after praise.

They don’t put things off. Why do people procrastinate? Sometimes it’s simply because they’re lazy. A lot of times, though, it’s because they’re afraid—that is, afraid of change, failure, or maybe even success. Confident people don’t put things off. Because they believe in themselves and expect that their actions will lead them closer to their goals, they don’t sit around waiting for the right time or the perfect circumstances. They know that today is the only time that matters. If they think it’s not the right time, they make it the right time.

The only time that counts is NOW. For small things, I try to make an effort to do them right away after I think about them - against my mind's tendency to immediately come up with an excuse why they can be done later. For bigger projects, I try to do a small part (sometimes very small) of the project now, just to get myself 'in the groove'.

They don’t pass judgment. Confident people don’t pass judgment on others because they know that everyone has something to offer, and they don’t need to take other people down a notch in order to feel good about themselves. Comparing yourself to other people is limiting. Confident people don’t waste time sizing people up and worrying about whether or not they measure up to everyone they meet.

Of course, in honest and deep talks we should share our observations and sometimes in a sense 'judge' other people. But we should be very careful about it. Being judgmental directly towards people is always a bad idea I think and leads to chaos and open or covert hostility, therefore dividing us. I find it difficult sometimes to resist the urge to judge - it is a distinct feeling somewhere in the lower solar plexus that I need to go against in such situations. The mirroring process is a different animal and the concept should never be an excuse to mechanically devalue other people just to feel superior.

They don’t avoid conflict. Confident people don’t see conflict as something to be avoided at all costs; they see it as something to manage effectively. They don’t go along to get along, even when that means having uncomfortable conversations or making unpleasant decisions. They know that conflict is part of life and that they can’t avoid it without cheating themselves out of the good stuff, too.

Very difficult for me, but it's absolutely necessary to engage in conflicts, and even embrace them when they inevitably come. I like the idea of 'managing' conflict - that's kind of what it is. Internal conflicts must be manged in the sense that we need to feel it deeply and learn to act independently of these feelings to an extent.

They don’t let a lack of resources get in their way. Confident people don’t get thrown off course just because they don’t have the right title, the right staff, or the money to make things happen. Either they find a way to get what they need, or they figure out how to get by without it.

I think this is mainly about not making excuses, and also learning to cope with feelings of uncertainty. For example, when I have financial worries, I try not to despair and do the important things anyway. Problems like lack of resources shouldn't become all-devouring monsters, but something to work on and with.

They don’t get too comfortable. Confident people understand that getting too comfortable is the mortal enemy of achieving their goals. That’s because they know that comfort leads to complacency, and complacency leads to stagnation. When they start feeling comfortable, they take that as a big red flag and start pushing their boundaries again so that they can continue to grow as both a person and a professional. They understand that a little discomfort is a good thing.

Warrior's attitude: when we get too comfortable, there's something wrong. Comfort comes in various forms and shapes, so I think it's important to learn to recognize the feeling of comfort and 'shake it off', i.e. not falling asleep.


Chu said:
Yes, some of those traits are shared by psychopaths and corporate guys, but don't ignore the different goals and motivations. Don't ignore the factor of acting in spite of fears (which psychopaths tend to lack at a deeper level). Don't ignore the power of guilt, when it motivates us to do better because it's right (another thing psychopaths can't do). Don't ignore that some of those traits can help someone else's life, this forum being an example. Don't ignore that those traits can be used for good or bad, as with everything. Don't ignore that, when you have an Aim, then those warrior-traits are very much needed in order to make something happen. You can ignore it as "corporate talk", or you can take inspiration from it, I think.

Plus, not every successful business man/woman or successful person in general is a psychopath. We should be careful not to judge too quickly - how can we know? Some people become successful because they worked their issues out and did what is in them to do, working hard and playing the role life meant for them to play. I think these are often people who went through some kind of personality disintegration/crisis. Let's take them as an inspiration for attaining our own Aims and stop seeing psychopaths everywhere there is some money and/or success!
 

obyvatel

The Living Force
T.C. said:
I think I understand what you mean. That this kind of person is more free of neuroses. That the quote might easily to apply to an organic portal, or 'exterior man' or a primitively integrated type person; the kind of person who 'fits' in this world and isn't racked by any sort of angst, despair, depression, self-questioning; whose inner world is stable.

I guess such people who might be automatically like this may be effective at achieving their goals, but what kind of goals would be the question. Through their self-confidence, they might get their degree, find a high-paying job, start a family and do a good job of taking care of them, be a useful member of society, etc.

But perhaps someone for whom this kind of self-confidence has had to be worked at and with a personality they've had to work hard at might be more concerned with aims of a less exterior and prescribed nature, and more geared towards deeper, or greater, or 'higher' ideals due to a richer experience of life.

That maybe the first type of person has a solid belief system, but their beliefs may be less objective, whereas the latter type of person acts from a belief system that is more based in objective reality.

This brings up the question "is confidence more a genetic trait or a learned behavior/attitude"?

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/wired-success/200907/self-confidence-nature-or-nurture

Is self-confidence something that you're born with or is it taught and developed? It's the classic nature vs. nurture question. While current wisdom has been for some time that it's mostly nurture, there's some surprising new research that indicates we may genetically predisposed to be self confident.

Smart children on balance to do well in school. That may seem obvious, but there are a lot of exceptions to that rule. Some kids with high IQs don't ever become academic superstars, while less gifted kids often shine.

Why? Psychologists have focused on things like self-esteem and self-confidence—how good children think they are—to explain these outcomes. And the assumption has always been that such psychological traits are shaped mostly by parenting—by parents' beliefs and expectations and modeling. Researchers like Albert Bandura have argued that the initial efficacy experiences are centered in the family. But as the growing child's social world rapidly expands, peers become increasingly important in children's developing self-knowledge of their capabilities. So, until now, an individual's self-confidence was seen to be based on upbringing and other environmental factors.

Behavorial geneticist Corina Greven of King's College in London and her colleague, Robert Plomin of the Institute of Psychiatry, argue that self-confidence is more than a state of mind—but rather is a genetic predisposition. Their research, published in the June, 2009 issue of Psychological Science, is a rigorous analysis of the heritability of self-confidence and its relationship to IQ and performance.

They studied more than 3700 pairs of twins, both identical and fraternal twins, from age seven to age ten. Comparing genetically identical twins to non-identical siblings allows scientists to sort out the relative contributions of genes and the environment. Contrary to accepted wisdom, the researchers found that children's self-confidence is heavily influenced by heredity—at least as much as IQ is. Indeed, as-yet-unidentified self-confidence genes appear to influence school performance independent of IQ genes, with shared environment having only a negligible influence.

The fact that self-confidence is heritable does not mean it is unchanging, of course. Siblings share a lot of influences living in basically the same home and community, but there are always worldly influences pulling them apart. A genetic legacy of self-confidence merely opens up many possible futures.

Greven and Plomin also found that children with a greater belief in their own abilities often performed better at school, even if they were actually less intelligent. They also concluded that same held true for athletes, with ability playing a lesser role than confidence.

So this study, supporting the nature argument for self-confidence should put the cat among the pigeons with coaches, psychologists, trainers and parenting experts, who have argued for some time that nurturing had the most significant influence on developing self-confidence.

Scientists have had debates on how much of confidence is inherited (or in 4th Way terms, comes from essence) and how much is learned. Some say 50-50. Others say confidence being a complex trait is more learned than inherited - like 75-25. The big 5 personality traits , openness to experience, conscientiousness, extraversion, agreeableness, and neuroticism (o-c-e-a-n) are considered, on an average, closer to the 50-50 split.
 
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