Session 18 September 2021

iamthatis

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I could not view the painting so I did a screenshot. Very likely scenario I suppose.

View attachment 59718

There are two different version of the Four Horses (wiki):
(1) Revelation 6 tells of a book or scroll in God's right hand that is sealed with seven seals. The Lamb of God/Lion of Judah opens the first four of the seven seals, which summons four beings that ride out on white, red, black, and pale horses. Zechariah describes them as "the ones whom the Lord has sent to patrol the earth," causing it to rest quietly. Ezekiel lists them as "sword, famine, wild beasts, and plague".

(2)In John's revelation, the first horseman rides on a white horse, carries a bow, and is given a crown – he rides forward as a figure of Conquest,[1][2] perhaps invoking Pestilence, Christ, or the Antichrist. The second carries a sword and rides a red horse and is the creator of (civil) War.[3] The third, a food-merchant riding upon a black horse, symbolizes Famine. He carries The Scales.[4] The fourth and final horse is pale, and upon it rides Death, accompanied by Hades.[5] "They were given authority over a quarter of the earth, to kill with sword, famine, and plague, and by means of the beasts of the earth."[6]

And then there are various interpretations of the white, red, black and pale horses, from many different angles and points in history, as described in the wiki article.

How do we make sense of these horses? Why are they different colours? Do the colours mean anything? Why are these Archetypes riding horses anyways? Is there any particular information that is trying to be communicated via these details?

These coloured horses are also featured elsewhere in mythology and folktales, as symbols of personal transformative change, or the mapping of some of life's possible roads. I remembered reading the following passage from poet and mythologist Robert Bly, in 'Iron John: A Book About Men', which is a small case study of information theory explored through the mythology of colored horses:

Riding the Red, the White, and the Black Horses

The story says that Iron John gave the young man a different coloured horse, saddle, and armor on each of three successive days, and we sense that some information is being offered in that detail. All we can do is to investigate the three colors and their associations, and see what happens.

We recall that the Queen in "Snow White" was sewing one day near an ebony window frame as the snow fell outside; and when she pricked her finger, three drops of blood fell on the snow. She said, "I want a child white as snow, red as blood, and as black as this window frame." The fairy-tale hero or heroine, whether in Russian, German, or Finish tales, who chances to see a drop of red blood fall from a black raven into the white now, sinks immediately into a yogic trance. That suggests the vast power red, black, and white have or have had over human consciousness up through the Middle Ages.

We'll look briefly at both African and European associations around red, white, and black. Victor Turner has gathered in his Ritual Process and A Forest of Symbols a great deal of information about the three colors in Africa. For the Ndembu tribe in Zambia, with which Turner lived for years, much in their religious system depends on distinctions suggested by these colors.

Red for the Ndembu is the blood of brith, menstrual blood, and blood shed by a weapon. The Ashanti add more associations to that: red for them stands also for the red earth, and so earth cults; also for war and witchcraft and the sacrifice of men and beasts. European associations hover close to the African ones. Margaret Walker in her Women's Encyclopedia of Myths and Secrets names red as the "blood-red thread of life." Europeans also add anger to it: "He saw red." Red suggests bull-like rages. "Never wave a red cloth at a bull."

White for the Ndembu and Ashanti peoples calls up semen, saliva, water, milk, lakes, rivers, "blessings by flowing water," the sea, and priesthood. Turner says of the Ndembu: "Whiteness represents the seamless web of connection that ideally ought to include both the living and the dead. It is the right relationship between people, merely as human beings, and its fruits are health, strength, and all good things. 'White' laughter, for example, which is visibly manifested in the flashing of teeth, represents fellowship and good company (The Ritual Process). Because of the association of white with semen, white suggests the masculine principle as red suggests the female principle. The opposition is not a simple one, however, because a white pullet [young chicken] means life and fertility, as against the red cock, which equals death and witchcraft. Turner says: "There is no fixed correlation between the colors and the sexes. Color symbolism is not consistently sex-linked, although red and white may be situationally specified to represent the opposition of the sexes."

For Europeans white retains the connection to blessing and milk, and it does suggest some qualities of good fellowship and strength. It also calls up the purity of children and brides, and by extension persons with high moral purpose, such as the white knight, who fights for purity, the Virgin, and the good.

Black is charcoal, river mud, and black fruits among the Ndembu, and it stand sfor badness and evil, the blackened corpse, suffering, having diseases, lack of purity, and for night and darkness. Turner adds that black also refers "to the concept of mystical or ritual death and to the related concept of the death of passion and hostility ... for the Ndembu, 'to die' often means to reach the end of a particular stage of development 'through death to maturity'." For Europeans, too, black means death and mourning. They add depression: "He is in a black mood." Also black suggests the left-hand path: "She is a black witch," or "He is a black magician." European and Egyptian alchemists' associations around black are very close to the Africans': black stands for crude matter, the "prima materia," lead, and Osiris' body when in the underworld.

The Great Mother Sequence

European fairy tales, when we examine them, insist on these three colors just as the Ndembu do, and in Europe, these three colors appear in a certain order. The best-known order or sequence of these colors is that mentioned in "Snow White": white, red, black. We can all this order the Great Mother sequence. White, red, black names the three phases of the moon: first the white of the Virgin as the New Moon; then the red of Motherhood as the Full Moon; and finally the black of the Crone as the Old Moon.

Barbara Walker, in her book on the Crone, goes over these three stages and their colors in great detail. We could say that each of us experiences innocence at first, then love and battle, then death, destruction, and knowledge. The old VIking myths report that when a human being dies, three cocks crow - first the white cock, then the red cock, then the black cock. So we all travel that road and it is a broad one. It is the Great Mother road - white, red, black.

The Alchemists' Sequence

The alchemists, Egyptian or European, have the same three colors, but begin with black. First is the black of the prima materia, the black of lead, the black of matter utterly untouched by spirit or consciousness. The want the black to deepen. "The black beast" must come forward, the old texts say, before growth starts. "Beauty and the Beast" says that as well.

In the second stage the black beast whitens, as the horizon before dawn slowly whitens. White here stands for a purification that is going on; imagination, spirit, and humor are developing. "But in this state of 'whiteness' one does not live in the true sense of the word; it is a sort of abstract, ideal state. In order to make it come alive, it must have 'blood', it must have what the alchemists call rubedo, the 'redness' of life (Jung).

The alchemists' third stage is the red of the rising sun. Now sulfur appears, flaring up, passion.
This is the path of men and women who want increased personality, more spirit, occult knowledge, who want spiritual lead to turn into spiritual gold. It beings maybe at forty-five, not at birth. We walk the lead-gold path as the same time we walk the life-death road.

The Masculine Sequence

Our story [Iron John] remembers the third road. If the Great Mother sequence lays out the feminine mysteries of life and death, and the alchemists' path lays out a neutral sequence, truth for both men and women, then we could say that Iron John's sequence lays out the masculine mysteries of wounding and growth. This road beings with red. It goes red, white, black.

If the young woman begins with the white of innocence or the white dress of confirmation, the boy begins with red. Red is the color of Mars. The old men initiators among the Gisu and Masai in Africa lead the young "moran" men immediately into the red: the young men are encouraged to flare up, fight, see red, get into trouble; and in emotions they are encouraged to express pride, to be arrogant, antisocial, quarrelsome, and be friends with anger. The girls encourage them to fight. An elder guides each young man, so that the fights don't result in fatal wounds. The young man may stay in the red stage for ten or fifteen years. During that time, the girls make love with them but will never marry such a man, because he is still unfinished; he has no respect, the elders say, he is too red.

When a young man is red, he shows his anger, he shouts at people, he flares up like a match with a sulfur tip, he flushes red with anger, he fights for what is his, stops being passive, walks on the balls of his feet, is a red hawk, is fierce. Of course no one trusts a red man very far.

A great Russian fairy story called "Prince Ivan and the Firebird" provides a vivid scene for the start of the red. A young warrior rides along and suddenly sees on the forest floor a feather "that has fallen from the burning breast of the great Firebird." Metaphorically, it is a red feather.

His horse advises him not to pick it up, for if he does, it will bring trouble. The young man picks it up anyway. Since the feather has fallen from the breast of the Firebird, we know it is connected to the heart - it is burning, fiery. It calls to the man as a vocation calls or as initiation calls.

The Middle Ages paid a lot of attention to Iron John's sequence, and we can see this movement from the Red Knight to the White Knight to the Black Knight clearly in the adventures of Parsifal. When Parsifal leaves his mother's house, where there were no adult men, he is a clumsy, naive fool. Almost immediately he kills the Red Knight and takes his armor - he himself becomes the Red Knight. How many misunderstandings he cause; how much rudeness and arrogance he has; how much antisocial behaviour he indulges in during his Red Armor time! But without the red, no white.

We try these days to move young men by compulsory education directly from childhood into the White Knight.

And we could say that sometimes a mother wants her son to be white when he is already in red. (Conversely, a man in midlife may want his wife to be white - and respectable - when she has already moved into red.)

We know that the Wild Man in our story gives the young man a red horse on the first day. The second day he gives a white horse. What shall we say about white?

A white knight is gleaming and shining. We usually make good fun of that, but a white knight is also engaged. He fights for the good, and he is no longer randomly antisocial. Ralph Nader is a white knight; he engages the corporate world.

We remember that Saint George was riding a white horse and wearing white armor when he engaged the dragon. Looked at positively, we could say that going into the white means that a man can have a relationship with the dragon. That doesn't imply killing the dragon. We know that the Christian crusaders, who found the Saint George and the dragon myth in Palestine, distorted it on returning home. In some old versions the dragon transforms into a woman, or gives treasure; he transforms himself. The dragon in old myths is not evil. He's a dark water-energy, a little regressed maybe, but his hunger is old and understandable.

A typical Celtic hero gets into a relationship with a dragon by throwing loaves of bread into his mouth. Of course he has to throw accurately, so we could say that some precision and skill enters with white.

The danger with the white knight stage in our culture is that he is often insufferable because he has not lived through the red. White knights in our culture support the cold war and project bad redness on the American Indians, or red communists, or wild women, or black men. If a man hasn't lived in the red stage, he is stuck a white knight who will characteristically set up a false war with some concretized dragon, such as Poverty or Drugs. The Bush-Dukakis debate was the sad debate of two stuck white knights. Such debates will be remarkably boring.

We could say that the moment the young Russian rider picked up the feather from the Firebird, he was already on his way, as the horse knew, to black.

On the third day Iron John gives the young man in our story a black horse, with a black saddle, black bridle, and black armor. He is riding his black horse when he makes his decisive descent into woundedness, and is wounded "by the King's men."

We can see increasing darkness at the edges of Rembrandt's paintings as he gets older. If you place Lincoln's photographs during his last four years, you can see him go into the black. People who are in the black usually give up blame. A mother once got into the White House and woke Lincoln at five in the morning, saying that her son had seen sent by train to Washington a few days before, had had no asleep, had been assigned to guard duty on arriving, had fallen asleep, and now was going to be shot at eight that morning. If Lincoln had been in the red, he might have shouted for the guards, "Who let this woman in here? Get her out of here!" If he were in the white he might have said, "Madam, we all have to obey rules. Your son didn't obey the rules, and I feel as bad about it as you do, but I can't intervene." He didn't say either of those things. He said, "Well, I guess shooting him wouldn't help much," and he signed a piece of paper. We notice that humor comes in with the black.

If we take nothing else away from the Iron John story, we could usually take this idea that the young male moves from red intensity to white engagement to black humanity. Each man is given three horses to ride at various times in our lives; we fall off and get back on.

I don't think we should consider one horse better than another; all we could ay is that none should be skipped. We need three skills, for each horse has its own sort of gait; each horse shies at different things, responds to a rider differently.

Teachers and parents often tell us to skip the red horse. Some men did not live through the red in adolescence. Such a man then will have to go back to red later, learn to flare up, and be obnoxious when he is forty.

Ministers often find themselves forcibly confined to white because they skipped red, and their congregations won't let them go back to it. But then they can't go forward into black. Politicians have to look white, while actually being God-knows-what color. Anwar Sadat undoubtedly got to the black while in prison; more politicians should probably be put in prison. It would probably be good for poets as well.

When a person moves into the black, that process amounts to bringing all of the shadow material, which has been for years projected out there on the faces of bad men and women, communists, witches, and tyrants, back inside. hat process could be called retrieving and eating the shadow.
Robert Frost ate a lot of his shadow, which is certainly part of his greatness. he talks of the shadow in his marriage. A husband and wife are driving through the woods in a buggy pulled by a single horse. Suddenly a man steps out of the trees and stabs the horse in the heart. The couple, Frost says, were "The most unquestioning pair that ever accepted fate."

We assumed that the man himself
Or someone he had to obey
Wanted us to get down
And walk the rest of the way.


A man who goes into the black has to "walk the rest of the way." It takes a long time to move into the black. How many years pass before a man finds the dark parts of himself that he threw away? When does he find those parts, and retrieves them, other people will begin to trust him.

When he is able to ride on the black horse, then the horse itself will carry him to the place where the King's men wound him. At that instant, his golden hair falls down over his shoulders so that everyone will know who he is ... but that's another part of the story.

So if I were to try my hand at the Apocalypse Sequence, which features another horse, the pale horse, applied to our time, it might go something like this.

There comes a time when the world is in so much tension that a signal is sent out to the cosmos, a cry of despair, or a bugle call to these Four riders. This signal comes from human hearts and minds in a great deal of pain.

The first horse to arrive is the White Horse, carrying Conquest. There is the false whiteness of NATO, carrying the tired old hypocritical Imperial standard of Democracy, the End of History, and also the new heraldry of the Great Reset, and the unipolar attempt at Conquest the world over. with the main hotspots being Ukraine and Taiwan. The Russian SMO is really a counter-Conquest operation. The Russian SMO carries many real white characteristics - protection of their Slavic brothers in the Donbas from genocide, preventing biowarfare from entering their territory, the safeguarding of common sense values of family and tradition against moral degeneracy, and standing up in a very principled, objective, and law-abiding way, to the psychopathic war machine of NATO. We'll see what happens if Taiwan flashes up.

The second horse is Red, carrying War, or even more specifically civil war. The White Horse's defence against the tyrants causes a global alchemical reaction. The pain that initiated the calling in of the riders in the first place intensifies - and conflict within countries, and between countries also intensifies. Already-existing lines of strife come to a head. Those who have some white in them take heart at Russian's stand against the madness, and are emboldened to take steps in the creation of a new world. They see that there is a choice to be made in life. This only causes the deranged elites to engage in even more horrible control measures, such as freezing bank accounts of dissenters, shutting down speech, all the way to conscription, letting loose greenbaummed mass shooters, the purposeful collapse of the economy to create total dependency on the old regime, etc. These measures do not break the white opposition, but merely set the stage for war, internal or external or both. This would most likely play out in another way, where it's not the mechanical vs. the conscious, but sleeping elements within any given nation being set at each other's throats (republicans vs. liberals, Muslims vs. Christians, etc.). The red horse charges up the anger to approach blind rage.

The Black horse with the scales arrives, carrying Famine - and given the point we are said to be at in the Grand Cycle, this is not your 'usual, everyday famine'. This Horse has the potential to cast a black shadow across the whole world. Crops don't grow in this shadow. Especially when Blackrock is wielding so much economic power. What this means specifically is that the shape of our daily lives, and the way we See, may change in this blackness. We will most likely see what hunger does to a population of sleeping humans. Malnourishment results in less capacity to think, or perhaps only black thoughts, leading to a ravenous black Beast to show itself on a grand scale, whether that is normalized cannibalism (energetic or physical), black magic, etc. With increasingly compromised health in every way due to lack of food, we may see the results of the black horse not just on the news, but in our daily lives as people's bodies change before our very eyes, becoming thinner and weaker, more angry and hungry. With little food, the people of the world may be hard pressed to find an alternative to dependency on the State. It portends to this sort of situation weighed on the Black Rider's scales: one digital denarius for a day's labour - which pays just enough for one loaf of GMO cricket bread. Black humour.

The Pale horse arrives, bringing Death and Hades, with a particular uplifting note of also being a harbinger of plague and pestilence. Death arrives on a Pale Horse - but there's death around us every day, so what's the big deal? Sure, death is there, we all know it - but I'd wager this knowing is intellectual for most of us, and not felt in the body. Many of us don't kill our own food, let alone see dead human bodies with much regularity. This may change. We may need to get used to the sight, the smell, and the corresponding feelings, sensations and thoughts that arrive when faced with more corpses than we'd ever thought we would lay our eyes on. When someone is in shock, they often go pale, as all the blood rushes from the extremities to the core in a state of intense stress. This may be an apt description for the arrival in our lives of Death on the Pale Horse. As I'm riffing on the pale theme here, I recalled that it appears in Ashworth's book 'Paul's Necessary Sin'. With all of this challenging Horse-talk, it would be good to end with some Paul, I think, because (1) he went through his own version of Apocalypse after the death of Caesar, and (2) Ashworth's section also provides some important insights in how we might live when one knows that the Pale horse is coming - to keep aligned with the principles of highest possible value. One who has truly sought Truth has in some way 'died to the world' already, and as such is more prepared to greet Death and the other Three Riders on their horses of transformation, and knows that 'a new creation' is nigh.

He is speaking about the use and misuse of the verb stoicheo, and is attempting to "bring a sharp vividness to the passage that is not present in normal translations". From his section Keep aligned by the cross:

'May I never boast of anything except the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which the world has been crucified to me, and I to the world. For neither circumcision nor uncircumscision is anything; but a new creation is everything! As for those who will follow this rule - peace be upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.' (Gal 6:14-16)

The RSV uses 'walk' instead of 'follow' to translate stoicheo:

'Peace and mercy be upon all who walk by this rule, upon the Israel of God.' (Gal 6:14-16, RSV)

Using either 'follow' or 'walk' for stoicheo in this passage means that the vivid force of the image Paul is presenting is completely lost. For that image to emerge depends on the interpretation of two other words in addition to stoicheo : 'cross' and 'rule'.

To begin with the world translated 'cross' (stauros). Although now the word is understandably almost totally identified with the Roman instrument of execution, the Greek word simply means a 'pale' as in 'a spiked post for a fence' or 'stake'. While 'pale' is rarely used in modern English, it does allow an insight into the vivid way in which Paul is peaking of himself:

'May I never boast of anything except the pale (stauros) of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which the world has been impaled (estaurotai) to me, and I to the world. (Gal 6:14, adapted NRSV).

The sharp wooden stake in the ground on which Jesus died as become the means by which the world has died to Paul, and Paul to the world.

The word translated 'rule' (kanon) has a closely related meaning. The reason that the world comes to be used for 'rule' is that its root meaning is that of a straight stick. However, a straight stick, as well as being a useful ruler, can also be used as a boundary marker and the Greek word can also carry the sense of a demarcated territory. Paul himself uses the word with this latter sense in the second latter to the Corinthians when he speaks of the particular area in which he has preached the gospel. In the RSV, kanon is translated 'field':

'We do not boast beyond limit, in other men's labours; but our hope is that as your faith increases, our field among you may be greatly enlarged, so that we may preach the gospel in lands beyond you, without boasting of work done in another's field.' (2 Cor 10:15f, RSV).

In this passage, Paul is clearly distinguishing the areas designated to him for preaching the gospel from areas designated for others - the NRSV replaces 'field' with 'sphere of action'. Although the RSV translates the word kanon as 'field', the sense the word contains can still be detected in our ancient words for pointed sticks, 'stake' and 'pale'. We still speak of someone being 'beyond the pale' meaning 'outside of the accepted limit' and of 'staking a claim' meaning 'marking out our area'. Although the English word 'stake' may now carry unhelpful resonances, it still enables sense to be made of the passage:

'... our hope is that as your faith increases, our stake among you may be greatly enlarged...' (2 Cor 10:15, adapted NRSV)

The very clear and powerful image that is operating in Pual's thought opens to us once the literal meaning of these words is seen. it comes through connecting the pale on which Jesus died with a 'boundary marking stake' rather than 'rule', combined with the proposal of 'to keep aligned' rather than 'to walk':

'May I never boast of anything except the pale of our Lord Jesus Christ, by which the world has been impaled to me, and I to the world. For neither circumcision nor uncircumcision is anything; but a new creation is everything! As for those who will keep aligned by this stake - peace be upon them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.' (Gal. 6:14-16, adapted NSRV).

The 'pale' referred to is the cross; Paul says that this is the 'stake' or 'boundary marker' by which to keep aligned; nothing else, whether circumcision or uncircumcision, can be trusted.

Confirmation for the accuracy of this vivid image follows in the next verse, in which Paul again refers to the cross as a sharp pointed stake:

'From now now, let no one make trouble for me; for I carry the marks of Jesus branded on my body.' (Gal 6:17).

The Greek word translated here 'marks' (stigma) is the source of our English word 'stigmata' and means 'marks made by something pointed'.
 

Zzartemis

Jedi Council Member
Viktor Vasnetsov. Warriors Of The Apocalypse. The sketch for the painting of the Vladimir Cathedral in Kiev


So, we had pestilence (Covid), we are having war (Ukraine), famine is looming on the horizon (food/supply shortages) and death is not far behind (vaxx injuries)? :-/
JUNE 16, 2022:
-5001293012088760977_121-1.jpg-5001293012088760976_121.jpg
And there went out another horseAnd that was red: and power was given to him that sat thereon to take peace from the earth, and that they should kill one another: and there was given unto him a great sword.
--Rev 6:4
 

dredger

The Living Force
I could not view the painting so I did a screenshot. Very likely scenario I suppose.
What about the little horse at the middle + top who seems reading a book ?
1655644046789.png

The one who get enlightment through knowledge when the others represent ... i don't know exactly, hard to summmarize in a few words ... the normal human path, or, if you remember Mouravieff, the ones under the A influences, who contribute, as a whole, to the earth's organic life for earth's own evolution ?
 

Zzartemis

Jedi Council Member
i don't know exactly, hard to summmarize in a few words ... the normal human path, or, if you remember Mouravieff, the ones under the A influences, who contribute, as a whole, to the earth's organic life for earth's own evolution ?
Do you mean those who end up as Food for the Moon?

Mouravieff concurs with Gurdjieff and Ouspensky on the role of the Moon, but also warns:

"that organic life functions as a transmitter station sending refined energy to the Moon to assist its growth.

Despite increases in the human population and thus an increase in quantity of energy transferred, times of peace do not produce sufficient energy and so catalysts for suffering such as wars and catastrophes arise to sustain the process."



There are biblical references to this in Revelation:

The Harvest of the Earth
…18Still another angel, with authority over the fire, came from the altar and called out in a loud voice to the angel with the sharp sickle, “Swing your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of grapes from the vine of the earth, because its grapes are ripe.” 19So the angel swung his sickle over the earth and gathered the grapes of the earth, and he threw them into the great winepress of God’s wrath. 20And the winepress was trodden outside the city, and the blood that flowed from it rose as high as the bridles of the horses for a distance of 1,600 stadia.…
 

Bodizaffa

The Force is Strong With This One
To add to the above: although they considered cometary overhead explosion, they chose to blame a vulcano. They never considered that the cometary explosion could have triggered the vulcanic eruptions all over the world.
Science is being forced to change oh so reluctantly in mainstream cosmology and catastroism too. Although known by many. The sun plays a huge part in earth activity. Started watching space news regarding sun activity. As CMEs hit earth depending on strength, you'll get earthquakes and in turn volcanic activity.

Things are going to get interesting in our lifetime. Magnetic poles are shifting at a very fast rate and speeding up. Earth it speeding up rotation contrary to some belief. This month we are on path to break the fastest day. That keeps happening. We are going thru a change in the galactic current sheet and our magnetic feild is weakening. (which causes solar storms not so big to wipe out elons satellites) part of reason anyway. Our protection is growing weaker as we approach this 6000 yr cycle.

Sorry I'm a bit fuzzy so it rambles.. In the middle of the vid...
 

dredger

The Living Force
Do you mean those who end up as Food for the Moon?
Yes also, it matches, C's would answer that's it's natural, it's part of a natural cycle.
Now that i watch again this small horse, under a rainbow, this looks like the right illustation to the well known sentence "Knowledge protects". Rainbow could be seen as the consequence of the multitude of possible knowledges we can learn (or not), which encompass evertyhing ... I remember a good response from the C's about in one of the sessions, and I would say that how it was drawned shows that it protects this 5th horse.

And the rest of the text is "ignorance exposes to danger/perils" : look then the 4 horses for an illustration of that.
 

lilies

The Living Force
Or maybe horses peacefully grazed on the field and some Bible-age Unicorn-lover, Rainbow Color Worshiper Woke Crazies came along and painted pics of hell's demons on the backs of those peaceful horses "via works of art" and declared this peaceful nature will be destroyed if good religious people don't give them honey and bread!

Eagerness about the fulfillment of the worst kinds prophesies just attracts you toward them, to participate in those timelines turning red. Then you can say:
- There! The horses & riders! That's what I was talking about!

I think prophecies' role is to warn The People what to avoid, not to anticipate the 'gory end times'.
Its a personal choice for everybody.

Current matters can be resolved with sober thinking and common sense: a Triple Treat EAEU-SCO-ASEAN.

There is a nice golden Ariadne's Thread to follow in alternative news, for those who want to anchor better timelines.
It's breadcrumbs articles - coming out like the one linked above. Remember old Hollywood movie trailers: (narrator in a charismatic voice)
"In a world..where":

'Russia Would Become Lord Of The World': Here's What Baba Vanga Predicted About Putin

 

lilies

The Living Force

BHelmet

The Living Force
The interpretation of what is meant by food and moon is key. This has always been a baffling metaphor and if one goes all the way to the most extreme conjecture, well, the terror of the situation becomes clear.

In simplest terms, if the food is our suffering/awareness and the moon are our 4D STS “friends”, then…..

But is this true?

In that sense, I’d say the Moon is doing a lousy job of using these refined energies to evolve, because here we are; same as it ever was.

Perhaps the moon represents something else. It waxes and wanes and so affects the tides which can represent the human subconscious. In that sense the moon is more like a mechanical clock and less like a being.

So perhaps, like in an aspect of dream interpretation where “it’s all you”, the moon represents an aspect (perhaps collective?) of the human self.

Awareness of the fact we are part of a collective soul with a shared destiny?

Who the hell knows….
 

goyacobol

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
While I have spent quite a few years studying bible prophecies and other prophecies I have had to change many of my previous ideas about them after reading Laura's books and the sessions.

I can understand many of the reactions being expressed so I do not want to be overly critical of others' opinions on how these prophecies are being interpreted.

I will only try to share some of what the Cs say about prophecies and how that may give some food for thought.

I now think prophecy is not always written in stone so to speak.

Session 5 1994:
Q: (L) Of the several places around this country that we have
thought about moving, which one would we be happiest in?

A: Indefinite.

Q: (L) Would we be happy in the Blue Mountains in Oregon.

A: Not determinable.

Q: (L) Shouldn't you be able to give prophetic insights? {I was still stuck on the idea that a truly "valid" source would just give reams of prophecies that would come true. But, as we shall see, any source that does so as a "habit" is doomed to failure because of the probabilistic nature of reality. The future is not absolutely fixed! And therefore, only probabilities can be given, and then, only just before the event. However, the cyclical nature of "time" does give us a field of probabilities, and we were learning gradually of what this field consisted.}

A: Too many variables in this matter.


End of session

Being a fan of prophecy in general and living through a generation entralled by such books as Hal Lindsey's The Late Great Planet Earth I had some surprises when reading Laura's book The Secret History of the World And How to Get Out Alive. I had already begun to question my beliefs especially after my fathers' death in 1990. I am still on a journey that I had not anticipated but I am greatful for it because even though I do not have all the answers I think I have a much broader picture of reality than before from a source that I would have previously dismissed as totally taboo or discreditable.

Is all prophecy just fiction? I do not think that is the case but some prophecy or parts of it may be.

Session 7 October 1994:
Q: (L) If the Revelations are from the "bad" guys, are they an accurate portrayal of the end times?

A: Close.


Q: (L) What was the source of the prophecies of Isaiah?

A: Fiction.

One interesting thing about prophecies in general is that the Cs link them to The Quorum.

Session 25 October 1994:
Q: (L) Is the Quorum composed of members who are humans on this planet?

A: Partly.

Q: (L) Would we know any of them as well known figures?

A: Hidden. None you would know.

Q: (L) How is the Quorum important in regard to the Earth changes?

A: Watchers.

Q: (L) Why is it important to have watchers?

A: Keep track of prophecies.

I feel that the Quorum concept is possibly the most important one to apply to viewing our 3D prophecies and why they are being kept track of by the Watchers. I think that perhaps our reactions to events that appear to be the fullfilment of prophecy may be something that is being "watched".

Session 12 November 1994:
Q: (L) Back to the quorum and illuminati.

A: Quorum mostly alien; illuminati mostly human.

Q: (L) Well, the quorum has been described...

A: Meet; two halves of whole.

Q: (L) Well the quorum seems to be described as being in touch with the Cassiopaeans, that is, yourselves, which you have described as beneficial beings, is this correct?

A: Close.

Q: (L) The illuminati has been described as being behind or with the brotherhood which has been described as being in connection with the Lizard beings...

A: Close. But not that simple.

Q: (L) Well, if the quorum is the good guys and the illuminati is the bad guys, and they both are at the high levels of Freemasonry, what is the story here?

A: Picture a circle or cycle first now then contemplate for a moment before follow up.

Q: (L) Okay, I am contemplating a cycling circle.

A: Now, two halves representing positive and negative. Two halves.

Q: (L) Well, what I am getting out of that is the two halves and both sides are playing with the human race. Is that it?

A: No. This is complicated but if you can learn and understand, it will be a super revelation.

Q: (L) Well, go ahead and explain.

A: Ask step by step.

Q: (L) Why do we so often have to ask things step by step?

A: In order to absorb the information.

Q: (L) The quorum is described as the good guys. The illuminati is described as bad guys. And yet, they are both Masonic. When a person in the Masonic organization reaches the higher levels, are there individuals at the higher levels recruiting masons to one side or the other?

A: First, not exactly one side or another.

Q: (L) I am beginning to not understand something here because if the Lizzies...

A: Unblock.

Q: (L) I don't have a block here. If the brotherhood AKA illuminati AKA Lizzies AKA beast are the ones who are going to do detrimental things to this planet, how are they related or connected to the quorum which is in touch with...

A: This will take time to explain be patient it will be worth it.

Q: (L) Well, are you going to explain it right now?

A: Ask step by step.

Q: (L) Okay. What is the nature of evil?

A: Blend.

Q: (L) Are the Lizzies what we would consider to be evil?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Are the Cassiopaeans what we would consider to be good?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) Yet, do the Cassiopaeans use and manipulate the Lizzies to accomplish certain things?

A: No.

Q: (L) The Lizzies work independently and in opposition to the Cassiopaeans?

A: Independently, not in opposition.

Q: (L) Well then, is there somebody over and above this whole project...

A: We serve others therefore there is no opposition. Careful now. Step by step. If you do not fully understand answer ask another.

Q: (L) Part of a whole. Part of a circle.

A: Blend.

Q: (L) Does this mean...

A: Picture a blending colored circle image.

Q: (L) Are you saying that at some levels the two halves overlap?

A: Close.


Q: (L) Are you saying that some of the Quorum are good guys and bad guys and the same for the Illuminati because the two are on opposing sides of the circle but at the point of blending one is weighted more to one side and the other to the other side? And these organizations are where the interactions come together?

A: Closer.

Q: (L) Let's leave it for the time being.

A: No. Now please.

Q: (L) Okay. So it is a blending. Does it have something to do with ... in your case service to others means that you even serve those who serve self, is that correct?

A: Yes; we serve you and the Lizards have programed your race to self service remember.

Q: (L) Well, I am down a notch or two. So, I am still a service to self individual to some extent, is that correct?

A: But moving slowly toward service to others. Not all humans are.

Q: (L) Does this mean that when people who are members of the quorum or illuminati call for information or help, that you, because of your service to others orientation are obliged to answer whoever calls?

A: Yes and no.

Q: (L) What is the no part.

A: If vibrational frequencies are out of pattern we do not connect.

Q: (L) Is the work of the Lizzies part of an overall grand plan or design?

A: All is.

Q: (L) Let's go on. I am depressed because you guys told me I was a bad person.

A: You are not a bad person.

Q: (L) Well, I am feeling pretty crummy right now.

A: Lizzies induced.

Q: (L) You mean my crummy feelings are Lizzie induced?

A: As always.

Q: (L) Well I am feeling crummy because you guys let me know that I am in the same sinking boat as the rest of the poor slobs on this miserable planet. I was working pretty hard to get out of the boat.

A: Silliness; you're in your own boat.


Q: (L) I would like to know where Dr. Usui got the Reiki symbols?

A: Must answer question.

Q: (L) What question? The quorum and illuminati question?

A: You will feel ecstasy once answered.

Q: (L) Okay. A blending. Yet two halves.

A: Of a circle.

Q: (L) Who designed this circle?

A: Natural frequency wave. Some near conjunction blend both service patterns and each "camp" to create perfect balance.


Q: (L) Okay, so the Illuminati are the higher level on the pathway of service to self and somehow, by reaching these higher levels may have come to realizations or frequencies which have caused their position to be modified or blended to where service to self becomes or incorporates or moves them to service to others realizations, is this correct?

A: Continue.

Q: (L) Okay, the ones in the quorum are those who are focused on service to others and they, in their pathway of service to others begin to understand that some service to self is service to others.

A: Close.

Q: (L) And the whole idea is to blend both pathways no matter which direction you come to it from?

A: Service to others provides the perfect balance of those two realities; service to self is the diametrical opposite closing the grand cycle in perfect balance.

Q: (L) So it is necessary to have a pathway of service to self in order for the pathway of service to others to exist?

A: Yes.

Q: (L) And those who are in the quorum and the illuminati ...

A: Blends in middle.

Q: (L) So it is necessary to have the darkness in order to have the light...

A: Yes.

Q: (L) And it is necessary to have the Lizzies in order to have the Cassiopaeans...

A: Close.

Q: (L) And both groups evolved through the Masonic organizations..

A: Freemasonry is human reflection in physical of these processes.

Q: (L) Okay, thank you very much. I think that is all for tonight.

A: Good Night.

End of Session

I try to think of the above when observing what looks like the horsemen of the apocolypse approaching even though those horses look very real and perhaps many aspects of their function will be "close" enough for all of us to stay aware and alert as possible.
 

Bodizaffa

The Force is Strong With This One
Could you give a video reference for the "vid"?
Ha sorry. My speaking.. I meant I'm in the middle of covid.. Lasted over 2 yrs. Without getting it. It finally hit me..

As for info on this stuff.. A guy named Ben Davidson puts out some you tube weather news on it all. Every morning..
Spaceobservers. And published a book or two on it.. He's pretty good at finding all the study's, papers and news on the science.
 

iamthatis

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
While I have spent quite a few years studying bible prophecies and other prophecies I have had to change many of my previous ideas about them after reading Laura's books and the sessions.

I can understand many of the reactions being expressed so I do not want to be overly critical of others' opinions on how these prophecies are being interpreted.

I will only try to share some of what the Cs say about prophecies and how that may give some food for thought.

I now think prophecy is not always written in stone so to speak.

Session 5 1994:


Being a fan of prophecy in general and living through a generation entralled by such books as Hal Lindsey's The Late Great Planet Earth I had some surprises when reading Laura's book The Secret History of the World And How to Get Out Alive. I had already begun to question my beliefs especially after my fathers' death in 1990. I am still on a journey that I had not anticipated but I am greatful for it because even though I do not have all the answers I think I have a much broader picture of reality than before from a source that I would have previously dismissed as totally taboo or discreditable.

Is all prophecy just fiction? I do not think that is the case but some prophecy or parts of it may be.

Session 7 October 1994:


One interesting thing about prophecies in general is that the Cs link them to The Quorum.

Session 25 October 1994:


I feel that the Quorum concept is possibly the most important one to apply to viewing our 3D prophecies and why they are being kept track of by the Watchers. I think that perhaps our reactions to events that appear to be the fullfilment of prophecy may be something that is being "watched".

Session 12 November 1994:


I try to think of the above when observing what looks like the horsemen of the apocolypse approaching even though those horses look very real and perhaps many aspects of their function will be "close" enough for all of us to stay aware and alert as possible.

You raise a good point. We can read the description of the four horses as prophecy, or something in the realm of myth. Yet we can also read these passages as a form of history, too, or the attempt to pass down important objective information to the future generations. We are in the territory of the mythicization of history and historicization of myth. What gave rise to these pieces of writing? What were the social, economic, and cultural conditions from which these four horses broke onto the scene of the human imagination, and have been with us ever since?

Maybe these authors were simply describing the objective reality of historical cycles in the terms or language available to them - as four great horses from the sky, a startling image that is designed to key in a response from the subconscious, which apparently communicates through timeless imagery. In a sense, this would be one Western cultural version of a warning - THIS is what happens when leaders lose the 'Mandate of Heaven' as described in Earth Changes. This is precisely the point made by Micheal Hudson in his book entitled '...and forgive them their debts'. Although he is doing some iffy things like citing Luke and talking about Jesus as an historical figure, which casts doubt on his other sources, with some weed-reading I think the main thrust of his argument is pretty compelling as a hypothesis and worth entertaining.

Today's mainstream political and economic theories deny a positive role for government policy to constrain the large-scale concentration of wealth. Attempting to explain the history of inequality since the Stone Age, for instance, Stanford historian Walter Scheidel's 2017 book The Great Leveller downplays the ability of State policy to reduce inequality substantially without natural disasters wiping out wealth at the top. He recognizes that the inherent tendency in history is for the wealthy to win out and make society increasingly unequal. This argument has been made by Thomas Pinketty and based largely on the inheritance of great fortunes (the same argument made by his countryman Saint-Simon two centuries earlier). But the only "solutions" to inequality that Scheidel finds at work are the four "great levellers": warfare, violent revolution, lethal pandemics or state collapse. He does not acknowledge progressive tax policy, limitations on inherited wealth, debt writeoffs or a replacement of debt with equity as means of preventing or reversing the concentration of wealth in the absence of an external crisis.

The Book of Revelation forecast these four plagues as punishment for the greed and inequity into which the Roman Empire was falling. By late Roman times there seemed no alternative to the Dark Age that was descending. Recovery of a more equitable past seemed politically hopeless, and so was idealized as occurring only by divine intervention at the end of history. Yet for thousands of years, economic polarization [between parasitic elites and the masses] was reversed by cancelling debts and restoring land tenure to smallholders who cultivated the land, fought in the army, paid taxes and/or performed corvee labor duties. That also would be Byzantine policy to avoid polarization from the 7th through 10th centuries, echoing Babylonia's royal proclamation of clean slates.

Within Judaism, rabbinical orthodoxy attributed to Hillel developed the prosbul clause by which debtors waived their right to have their debt cancelled in the Jubilee Year [Hudson describes this later as being analogous "the kind of stratagem that today's banks use in the "small print" of their contracts obliging users to waive their rights to the courts and instead submit to arbitration by bank-friendly referees in case of dispute over credit cards, bank loans or general bank malfeasance. Creditors had tried to use similar clauses already in the Old Babylonian era, but these were deemed illegal under more pro-debtor royal law]. Hillel claimed that if the Jubilee Year were maintained, creditors would not lend to needy debtors - as if most debts were the result of loans, not arrears to Roman tax collectors and other unpaid bills. Opposing the pro-creditor argument, Jesus announced in his inaugural sermon that he had come to proclaim the Jubilee Year of the Lord cited by Isaiah, whose scroll he unrolled. His congregation is reported to have reacted with fury. (Luke 4 tells the story). Like other populist leaders of his day, Jesus was accused of seeking kingship to enforce his program on creditors.

Subsequent Christianity gave the ideal of debt amnesty an otherworldly eschatological meaning as debt cancellation became politically impossible under the Roman Empire's military enforcement of creditor privileges. Falling into debt subjected the Greeks and Romans to bondage without much hope of recovering their liberty. They no longer could look forward to the prospect of debt amnesties such as had annulled personal debts in Sumer, Babylonia and their neighbouring realms, liberating citizens what had fallen into bondage pr pledged and lost their land tenure rights to foreclosing creditors.

The result was destructive. The only debts that Emperor Hadrian annulled were Rome's tax records, which he burned in 119 AD - tax debts owed to the palace, not debts to the creditor oligarchy that had gained control of Rome's land.

A rising proportion of Greeks and Romans lost their liberty irreversibly. The great political cry throughout antiquity was for debt cancellation and land redistribution. But it was achieved in such classical times only rarely, as when Greece's 7th-century BC tyrants [tyrant being the name for populist leaders] overthrew their cities' aristocracies who had monopolized the land were subjecting the citizenry to debt dependency. The word "tyrant" later became a term of invective, as if liberating Greek populations from the bondage to a narrow hereditary ethnic aristocracy was not a precondition for establishing democracy and economic freedom.

The study of the long sweep of history reveals a universal principle to be at work: the burden of debt tends to expand in an agrarian society to the point where it exceeds the ability to debtors to pay. That has been the major cause of economic polarization from antiquity to modern times. The basic principle that should guide economic policy is recognition that debts which can't be paid, won't be. The great political question is, how won't they be paid?

There are two ways not to pay debts. Our economic mainstream still believes that all debts must be paid, leaving them on the books to continue accruing interest and fees - and to let creditors foreclose when they do not receive the scheduled interest and amortization payments.

This is what the U.S. President Obama did after the 2008 crisis. Homeowners, credit-card customers and other debtors had to start paying down the debts they had run up. About 10 million families lost their homes to foreclosure. Leaving the debt overhead in place meant stifling and polarizing the economy by transferring property from debtors to creditors.

Today's legal system is based on the Roman Empire's legal philosophy upholding the sanctity of debt, not its cancellation. Instead of protecting debtors from losing their property and status, the main concern is with saving creditors from loss, as if this is a prerequisite for economic stability and growth. More blame is placed on debtors, as if their arrears are a personal choice rather than stemming from economic strains that compel them to run into debt simply to survive.

Something has to give when debts cannot be paid on a widespread basis. The volume of debt tends to increase exponentially, to the point where it causes a crisis. If debts are not written down, they will expand and become a lever for creditors to pry away land and income from the indebted economy at large. That is why debt cancellations to save rural economies from insolvency were deemed sacred from Sumer and Babylonia through the Bible."

And without these sacred acts of forgiveness - the only place for the imagination to go is into the apocalyptic and eschatological, perhaps giving rise to the Four Horsemen. So whether it is a channelled prophecy, or dressed-up economic forecasting, or a reiteration of some older Knowledge of what FRV changes of the human-earth connection during certain periods in cometary cycles - or all three - I can't say for sure. But I can say I find it fascinating to read.

Debt forgiveness was divine right of kings in the Near East. Often a new King would inaugurate the first days of his reign with a Grand Jubilee, and the debts of all the small folk to the Palace or Temple would be forgiven. But it wasn't a revolution. The small folk were given back their lands, and bondservants would be returned home. The debts of merchants and entrepreneurs went untouched. The rural people returned to the possibility of productive self-sufficiency, and could get back to work, and begin generating income that could be taxed. The Grand Jubilee was a re-establishment of the tax base. Their return to the land often came with promises to either fight in the army if need be, or participate in public works projects, known as corvee works. So the Grand Jubilee also re-established a loyal standing army, and the possibility of mass infrastructure maintenance or improvements. Love for king country and social cohesion was restored.

It is in this context that I can begin to wonder about the fear of Caesar becoming king. I never understood why it was such a big deal. He was already Caesar. What can a dictator-for-life gain by becoming a King? Or what could the elites lose if he became king? Well, maybe they were worried he would call a Grand Jubilee year and destroy their entire parasitic economic feeding system ... and destroy it with forgiveness, of all things!

And on another note, I think that one of the 'great political questions' of our current moment comes from considering the raging mountain of US debt; what the C's have said about the hoofbeats of the four horses approaching; how these two are very much connected in the human-cosmic connection kinda way; and then to wonder... how will US debt 'not be paid?'
 

goyacobol

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
It is in this context that I can begin to wonder about the fear of Caesar becoming king. I never understood why it was such a big deal. He was already Caesar. What can a dictator-for-life gain by becoming a King? Or what could the elites lose if he became king? Well, maybe they were worried he would call a Grand Jubilee year and destroy their entire parasitic economic feeding system ... and destroy it with forgiveness, of all things!

And on another note, I think that one of the 'great political questions' of our current moment comes from considering the raging mountain of US debt; what the C's have said about the hoofbeats of the four horses approaching; how these two are very much connected in the human-cosmic connection kinda way; and then to wonder... how will US debt 'not be paid?'

The debt system maximizing the Federal Reserve and equivalents in other countries plus the World Bank and the Bank of International Settlements has perhaps been the prime control factor for many generations along with control of information in practically every field of science, mathmatics and technology, not to mention control of everyday MSM.

The Cs said it well I think:

Session 19 November 1994:
Q: (T) Am I correct in saying that if they knew what was really going to happen that they would still continue with their stupid little plans to make money and try to control the world?

A: Yes. Greed is a sickness.

Greed is a sickness that has infected those who want to stay in control and it does not look like they will stop even though they may see the "writting on the wall". Sadly, I think we can hear the pounding of the "hoofbeats" getting closer as you have pointed out.
 
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