Genealogy- What do you know of your family?

Benjamin

Jedi Master
Not sure if thread should go here (History). Mod, please move if there's a more appropriate location.


“Genealogy is the study of families, family history, and the tracing of their lineages.” (Wikipedia)

I’d like to start this thread with an excerpt from this session:

(L) Well, on an adjacent topic to DNA, I would like to know why I feel... Um... compelled or obsessed by my genealogy database. [laughter] I'm embarrassed to talk about it because it's taken SO much time, and yet it's like I WANT TO KNOW!

A: Keep in mind that there is a certain power transmitted by awareness of ancestors.

Q: (L) How can there be power transmitted by awareness of ancestors? They're dead, first of all. Second of all, maybe those that had the potential have reincarnated and would be living other lives in other places. Or they'd be floating around in 5th density or whatever dead ancestors do...

(Artemis) Well, in a roundabout way, it's almost like knowing about your past lives.

(Andromeda) Yeah.

A: Yes

Q: (L) So, knowing past lives is helpful. Knowing ancestors is helpful. Well, the ancients believed that if you remembered your ancestors, they helped you. If you didn't take care of them or you forgot about them, they could bring bad luck on you. Can it? [laughter]

A: Something like that. You can help to heal some things and draw strength via your DNA antennae which, you must remember, is also their DNA antennae.

Q: (Andromeda) Makes sense.

(Chu) You inherited their receivers.

(Andromeda) And you can learn things from their experiences thereby.

(Pierre) You were wondering about how you relate to them. They're dead, they're far away. Sharing the same DNA antennae, if we are connected via DNA to an information field, and you have other people with similar DNA connected to a similar part of the field, and time really doesn’t exist on other planes, then you can access these kinds of memories or information shared by ancestors...?

A: Exactly.

Q: (Pierre) Wow.

(Joe) There's also epigenetics...

(L) I keep saying that reading all this early American history tells me why Americans are the way they are. They are completely messed up. But then, so is everybody else!! It's terrible.

(Chu) Epigenetics is only about this life, right?

(L) Oh no! Oh no! Your parents can have methylation that gets passed on to you. All kinds of weird stuff can happen. You just would not believe it. So in other words, we're back to ancestor worship! [laughter]

(Artemis) Get some incense and a shrine!

(Pierre) Is one of the reasons for the importance of the cult of ancestors this relation to the information field via DNA?

A: Yes. They went a bit far with it and forgot why it was important.

Q: (Andromeda) Like Halloween.

(L) Yeah. It just got distorted. But then...

A: We keep telling you that we are you in the future. You are them in the future.

Q: (L) So, my present is their future.

(Andromeda) We're the Cs ancestors! [laughter]

(Artemis) They're honoring us!

(Joe) So, maybe some of your ancestors are on a Ouija board trying to contact you. They're trying to get some information.

(L) This is getting too weird... [laughter] So, it would be useful for people to at least know as many of their ancestors as they can possibly know?

A: Yes and some ancestors are stronger than others.

Q: (L) So, if you have a strong recent ancestor, that's pretty good. So, in a certain sense, you could tune in to your ancestors and derive strength from them? Kind of like... a choir of angels sort of thing?

A: Close but don't go all woowoo on us now!

Q: [laughter] (Joe) If you're gonna tune in to your ancestors, you better pick the right one. Don’t be pickin' that one guy...

(Andromeda) The cowboy?

(Joe) The one who never slept in a bed.

(L) Oh, you mean my wonderful ancestor Bone Mizell. Well, he's not exactly an ancestor. He's like first cousin 4 times removed or something. He was first cousin to my great-great grandmother. And what a character!

(Joe) Well, that's why if you're gonna commune with them, you have to know as much about them as possible. Know which ones you don't want to get any advice from.


Dream- Past Lives (c.2000)

I remember being semi-interested about my past lives and I think it was rather popular at the time. So, one evening before going to bed, I posed the request to see my past lives. I can’t remember if it was that night or a night soon after that I had a very short and slightly “foggy” dream that was sandwiched like a book on the shelf between other dreams. The scene in front of me was a muted grassy field with some leafy, green trees in a row and some bushes growing in a wild setting. The lighting was subdued like that of a cool, overcast sky. There was “a person” standing a little ways in front of me looking at me. Didn’t speak, didn’t move, and had no expression and yet was not “expressionless”. What this person was doing was morphing, very quickly, into all kinds of other people. Tall, short, fat, thin, huge beards, clean shaven, long hair, male, female, glasses, dresses, hats, aprons, trousers, you name it. Some of them, I think, held objects, like a hoe or pick maybe. All of them also seemed to be dressed like working-class people. That I recall, I didn’t see any (or perhaps very few?) white-collar clothes, but I could be wrong. The dream only lasted maybe 2-4 seconds and faded out even as the morphing continued. I didn’t recognize any of them. They were just people in period attire that you would see in the stores, houses, farms and on the streets of their time.


There is a very simple (and linear) equation that boggled my mind when I kept hitting the "equals" button:
You have: 2 parents, 4 grandparents, 8 great-grandparents, 16 great-great-grandparents... etc.
Only 20 generations back (700-1000 years) you have 1,048,576 million people who made you.
That's just nutz!

In a nutshell, here is what I have:

My dad’s father’s line comes from Mecklenburg (English/German), Germany. For centuries, this line lived within a 10 km north-east to south-east fan from Wittenburg, Germany (about 60 km east of Hamburg, and not to be confused with (Lutherstadt) Wittenberg which is about halfway between Berlin and Dresden), in little towns and villages with the names Dreilützow, Bobzin, Harst and Parum dating all the way back to c.1610. This line is very interesting to me since there is a possible Polabian connection. The Polabians (Polaben) were a sub-tribe from the Obotrite (Abodriten) group of Slavic people that moved into Mecklenburg by following the Elbe (Labe in Czechia) river in the 6th-8th centuries. The Polabians were conquered by the Saxons and Danes by the 9th century, germanized by the 13th, and their (Lechitic) language completely extinct by the 18th century. However, evidence of this language still exists in the names of the cities and towns as well as a scant few other printed locations ("Vocabularium Venedicum" (1679–1719) by Christian Hennig; "Polabian-English Dictionnary" by Kazimierz Polański and James Allen Sehnert). There was also a fairly recent Polabian archaeological dig site just outside Wittenburg. (Documentary: “Die Slawen”) Directly in this family there are two Lutheran pastors, a Bäckermeister (master baker, in Rausdorf), a Ziegelmeister (master brick maker, in Hof Gallin but born in Bobzin), a Taglöhner (day labourer), a Schulmeister (schoolmaster), an Ader Gäden (vein/wood merchant?), a Schäfer (shepherd). There are others but I have no description of what they did.

There is a "possible" Jewish family that married into this main line (Levy, great-grandmother). I say “possible” because I don’t know if the line actually comes from the Caucuses or just adopted a Jewish name back in the day when it was a popular thing to do. I can’t go back very far at all with this line and am stuck in Altona, c.1800, although what I have uncovered are two instances of intermarriage.

My dad’s mother’s line comes from a town called Bardowick (English/German)just north of Lüneburg in Lower Saxony, Germay, back to c.1720. Directly in this line are two Schriftsezer (typesetter)/Buchdrucker (book printer), a Bahnwärter (signalman), a Landmann (farmer), and a Accisebeamten (tax official). There is a little booklet that we have that shows the history of this family. There were only two printed and were researched, printed and bound by my great-grandfather of this line. He had two daughters and he gave them each one as a gift. We may have the only copy left since the other daughter died (after a long life) and never married or had any children. In this book, the earliest member of this line (my 5th great-grandfather) fought in the Seven Years' War as a Hussar:

DeepL translation (I don't know how accurate this is): "In the Seven Years' War he served with the Hussars, came on his horse through the Elbe River and settled in Bardowick, where he later married." ("Im Siebenjährigen Kriege diente er bei den husaren, kam auf seinem Pferde durch die Elbegeschwommen und liefs sich in Bardowick nieder, wo er sich später verheiratet.")

In the same booklet, one of his son's (my 4th great-grandfather) is quoted of saying:

DeepL translation: "When he was asked about his heredity, he answered: "I am a child of the Hussars, I am in the mood for a fight!" ("Wenn er über seine Herkunst befragt wurde, antwortete er: "Ich bin ein Husarenkind, habe Lust zum Streit!"")

There was a daughter from another family from Schunkern (a (extinct?) village apparently near Memel (the old Teutonic Knight castle), now called Klaipeda (English/German) in the Baltic) who married the son that carried the name forward.

My mom’s father’s line is difficult. I can only go back to 1870 to Kisielowka (extinct village located about 14 km directly west of Volodymyr-Volynski, Ukraine). Documents are sparse at best but I don’t think they were in Volhynia long. This is the line that may come from Scottland/Ireland waaaay back based on the name. Farmers. Just farmers as far back as I can go. (This is the line where the story of Wanda comes from.)

My mom’s mother’s side is out of Weirzbie and Marcinow, both near Kutno, Poland, back to 1742. This is a Germanic line that may be out of Bavaria (based on the meaning of the name). This was a fun line because they were hiding under the very common Polish name Kurzawa for several generations. For a family to need an alias last name tells me something about the mindset of the place at that time. Again I have two instances of intermarriage. A document tells me they were “self-sustaining farmers”. Which is an interesting way of putting it and one possible reason why they needed an alias.

Cheers!
 

Laura

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
Yup, genealogy is a fascinating topic. I have a genealogy website here: Knight Genealogy It's curious to me how some of the apparent traits of ancestors have been passed down. Capt. Peter Knight was, apparently, a fire-breathing puritan, and his mother was a gr. gr. granddaughter of Sir Thomas More, executed by Henry VIII.
 

Benjamin

Jedi Master
Yup, genealogy is a fascinating topic. I have a genealogy website here: Knight Genealogy It's curious to me how some of the apparent traits of ancestors have been passed down. Capt. Peter Knight was, apparently, a fire-breathing puritan, and his mother was a gr. gr. granddaughter of Sir Thomas More, executed by Henry VIII.

"A Catholic, an Anglican and Capt. Peter walk into a bar..."

Your genealogy site is just massive! The Knights (and others) who look into their genealogies should consider themselves blessed to have you batting for them. Your introduction page was fantastic! Anyone who wants to start a tree (and many others who have a "tree") should read it. Everything you mentioned about Ancestry.com made me giggle it was so spot on. I've corrected transcribers entries, I've yelled at the screen because of what some people have done to their trees, I've quietly seethed at the returns from my search parameters.

I have to admit I was a bit jealous of your tree. Sorry. I was momentarily short-sighted. You did your work and the results are impressive. I did my work and can now love the family I've found.

Traits that get passed down are interesting. I see it in my family lines but only in a general way. I just don't have the documents that can provide a "personality", if you will. There is, however, a non-document exception that stands out in the Jewish line that seems to affect mostly the females. It's kinda like a certain type of "tunnel vision" that becomes wickedly defended once it locks itself in. There's also a funny little trait that has manifested itself physically in me. On my right foot, my pinky toe rides on top of the next toe. I was born with it, and apparently my mom's grandfather had it (but not her father). This trait even has a name: The (last name) Toe, which makes me think that others have had it before him, though no one has ever mentioned anyone else having it. Makes buying shoes a bit of a hassle since many shoes have a seam that runs right over my toe. Blisters. Ouch.

I don't know if I'll be able to move much farther back on my last name line without actually going to Germany, and even then... well, I don't know. So I've switched my focus a bit to finding if there's any evidence to support an idea that my family name might be at least partly Polabian in origin. It's just such an obscure, odd spelling that if I combine that with the whiffs of seemingly random info I've already found, my curiosity nibbles. There are also only approximately 69 people in the world with this name according to forebears.io so it's a spelling that's at risk of becoming extinct (me and my uncle are the only males in the entire western hemisphere who have it). Would love to talk about it but I'm not sure if it's a good idea to type out last names.

Anyway, I appreciate your post! It's gold! :-)
 

Tuulikki

Jedi Master
One of my favourite ever subjects to reseach. We, as a family, spent 10 glorious years trying to find ever more distant and ephemeral ancestors. We found that we had Irish, Scottish and English blood. A surprising number of pre-marriage pregnancies and sometimes when the first baby died, the next one of the same sex was given the same name. We were able to jump to some fairly certain conclusions when we found out that most families seemed to follow the tried and tested tradition of the first son being named after the father's father, the second son being named after the mother's father etc. Not always to be relied on obviously but very helpful. We had a few very naughty people but nobody of note that we have found so far. (I envy Laura her tree). We eventually made it back to the 1600's with a few lines but some stopped in the 1800's and we could find nothing to take us any further.

One of the mosty exciting things was discovering new surnames to be added to the list, especially unusual ones. So much easier to research. I felt a great empathy with my ancestors and often wished that I could have known them. In some ways I do know them of course - we share DNA and perhaps memories - who knows.

Probably the most interesting thing we found out was that my father died 104 years after his eldest sister.

I am planning on keeping an awareness of my ancestors and improving my DNA antennae for the future as per the C's advice.
 

Laura

Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
FOTCM Member
One of my favourite ever subjects to reseach. We, as a family, spent 10 glorious years trying to find ever more distant and ephemeral ancestors. We found that we had Irish, Scottish and English blood. A surprising number of pre-marriage pregnancies and sometimes when the first baby died, the next one of the same sex was given the same name. We were able to jump to some fairly certain conclusions when we found out that most families seemed to follow the tried and tested tradition of the first son being named after the father's father, the second son being named after the mother's father etc. Not always to be relied on obviously but very helpful. We had a few very naughty people but nobody of note that we have found so far. (I envy Laura her tree). We eventually made it back to the 1600's with a few lines but some stopped in the 1800's and we could find nothing to take us any further.

One of the mosty exciting things was discovering new surnames to be added to the list, especially unusual ones. So much easier to research. I felt a great empathy with my ancestors and often wished that I could have known them. In some ways I do know them of course - we share DNA and perhaps memories - who knows.

Probably the most interesting thing we found out was that my father died 104 years after his eldest sister.

I am planning on keeping an awareness of my ancestors and improving my DNA antennae for the future as per the C's advice.

You've obviously done some work!

I found one Knight family that had three sons named Arthur, the first two having died. They were sure determined! And yes, naming patterns can often help a lot when they hold up.

I was contacted by an adopted person who was a second cousin, genetically. I was able to figure out who his mother very likely was, a cousin of my mother who never married....

Then, I was also contacted by a family with a different last name but were Y-DNA linked to Knights. There was a story in their family that the illegitimate son of a gr gr gr grandmother was sired by a certain man named Knight. I think I was able to figure out who he was too based on who was located where at the time. Another family contacted me about a similar issue and simply were not able to accept that a Knight fathered their ancestor...

So yeah, lots of family skeletons can come out of the closet!
 

alkhemst

Dagobah Resident
I’ve been looking for a thread that members posted their family-tree-DNA results. I recall I had a post there and hoping to compare changes on this map. But double checking if that is private now? In any case I noticed what looks like a few changes to the mix.
 

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psychegram

The Living Force
Very cool stuff.

I had a second cousin once removed (or something like that, I get hazy on distant relations) who delved into the genealogy on my father's side. Traced it back to a Hessian who came over to fight for King George against the American rebels. She didn't trace it further back than that, since additional genealogical records would have required access to European records, and none of us speak German or lives in Europe. I think this is a general issue for North Americans ... things tend to get quite vague regarding the old world. I can't help but wonder whether that helps to explain the sense of rootless disconnection that characterizes so many American families.

On my mom's side, we can trace things back a couple hundred years to the British isles. Recently my mom started going through family records, and she found a book-length memoir written by a great-aunt about her experience coming to Canada as a small girl. My mother and my aunt worked together for the last year or so to edit and format it properly, in order to publish it ... mainly for family to have. I'm getting my copy soon and quite excited about it.

While she was working on it she came across a number of old pictures, which of course she shared. When I saw my great great grandfather I felt a chill go up my spine. It was like looking in a mirror. I'm his spitting image. This was especially meaningful to me given that he was quite the character - a world-travelling entrepreneur and patriarch with an absolutely irrepressible sense of adventure. The more I learned about him the more inspired I was.

There's a real psychological power there. If your ancestors did impressive things - even if only impressive to the family - that tells you that you can do those impressive things, too. After all, you share their blood, so whatever potential they realized is potential you have access to. Of course that cuts both ways - if your family are all drunks and screwups, you'll have a harder time breaking that pattern as your subconscious will assume you're no better than them. I've seen this in others many times and it always breaks my heart. It's something worth keeping in mind, that your life should not only be a credit to your ancestors, but should also be an inspiration to your descendents: not only to you inherit a template, but you have it in your power to modify it, and it's your responsibility to pass on that template in at least as good condition as you received it.

Final thought is that passing it on is as much genetic as spiritual. You can screw up by leading a bad life and setting a poor example, but you can also screw up by choosing a mate poorly and polluting your bloodline. As an example, if my mother had for instance chosen to marry a black man, the dominant nature of sub-saharan genetics would mean that I would not resemble my maternal line in the slightest. I would never have felt that shock of recognition looking at my great great grandfather's picture, would feel little if any connection to my maternal lineage, and would therefore be unable to draw inspiration and strength from their example. By choosing a mate from a similar ethnic background, on the other hand, the genetics and therefore phenotype are more effectively conserved, and that ancestral connection remains stronger.
 
My great grandfather was an Austrian immigrant, my great great grandfather brought my last name Prentice from England, and my mother and brother both bear the McLaren name from Scotland. Extended genealogy shows ancestors from Ireland and Wales too. Genealogy is fascinating to me.
 

BHelmet

Dagobah Resident
It is an enticing subject. From whence did we come? I got sucked into one of the DNA sites which I suppose I now regret but it is interesting what can be gleaned that way none the less:

The random wandering or fleeing Armenian from Turkey making his or her way to Italy to intermix before my great grand parents came from Napoli to Los Angeles in the 1800’s. The Spanish aloofness mixed with The Native American brand of stoicism.

It is always a fun game and perhaps even a 4th way type exercise to name the bio-genetic source of the inner impulses. Racist, in a way? I suppose, But it is self observation. The impetuous emotional Spaniard in me is a real thing. I have to keep a leash on that one but it is a part of what I chose to work with in this life.

Hello. My name is Inigo Montoya. Prepare to die

What is also fun is to find a goldmine of work some one already did. I found a tree of mine on Ancestry that goes back To the mid 1600’s when the Scots-Irish we’re Coming to the US. I even have the same last name! An unbroken line almost 400 years. Cool.

And yeah. I do think about these past gals and guys and try to honor and recognize them in me.

These days it is the Yaqui ancestors I most relate to. ForEver Fighting against and retreating from a foreign onslaught while trying to maintain their independence.

To this very day.
 

psychegram

The Living Force
It is always a fun game and perhaps even a 4th way type exercise to name the bio-genetic source of the inner impulses. Racist, in a way? I suppose, But it is self observation.

I know exactly what you mean. I've always been fascinated by the very different personalities of the two sides of my family. My mother's: restless, world-travelling wanderers, with cool analytical minds. My father's, passionate, deeply rooted people of the earth. I see both in my own psychological make-up.

It's quite obvious that this is genetically based. The traits are simply too stable to be merely cultural.

As to being racist, well yes, inevitably. But it's long past time for us to move past reflexive condemnation of any awareness of biological differences between groups because it's "racist". Those differences make us who we are.
 

Debra

Jedi Council Member
I have been fascinated with “Ancestral Healing” for some time. Came across this brilliant presentation this morning, and felt it should go in this thread.
Hope to access my files on my computer in the next few days, I have compiled a few papers regarding DNA and ancestral influences.
This video has some views that strongly correlate with my research, for what it’s worth.
 
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