Czech subsection on quantumfuture.net

rylek

The Living Force
FOTCM Member
I would like to ask about the possibility of opening a Czech subsection on quantumfuture.net, in addition to the French, German, Spanish and Polish. I am therefore wondering if such a thing is possible and how to possibly go about it.

I have already started my own blog where I use material from Cass and SOTT. Hardly any information of this kind, especially topics on psychopathy, OPs, the Wave etc., is available in the Czech Republic (as far as I know). The usual fare is the photon-belt-ascension-you-create-your-own-reality type topics. I have recently mentioned this here on the forum:

http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=4984
rylek said:
Of course, rather than trying to get material posted on various websites (which, if done in the right way, can still be an open possibility) I would be more than happy to dedicate myself to a Czech subsection on quantumfuture.net. That this effort would be the main focus. Actually, I have thought about this before as it made the most sense to me, but on the other hand I felt that I have not been 'actively around' the forum for long enough to suggest anything of this sort, osit.

Maybe to start thinking about the Czech subsection, what would be the preferred way to start? I have some ideas on how to go about it but do realize that in this case others are in a better position suggest how to get this going And of course we are talking about someone else's hard work and that is another reason to make sure it is treated and presented the way it was intended to be.
I don't know if there are other Czechs that could help out.
 
I'm not sure if I went about this the right way. I will try to clarify my thoughts.

Translating for me in general is a way to improve my understanding of the material. In case of the SOTT/Cass it is, in addition, a possibility for those Czechs who do not speak English and might come across the material to read something in their language.

Because I already borrow heavily from the SOTT/Cass materials for my blog it made sense to translate SOTT/Cass articles/material 'officially'.

As I am a new member on the forum, I don't know how the translation of articles (or whole sections) works and in general I am still awkward in my interaction on this forum.

I realize that asking for an entire section on quantumfuture.net probably is too much to start with. But what I am asking is what to do with translated articles? At the moment I am quite swamped with Uni work as it's the end of term but I am working on translating the QFS work on psychopathy. Laura's articles Fire and Ice: The Day After Tomorrow, Climate Change Swindlers and the Political Agenda, Forget About Global Warming: We're One Step From Extinction! and The Hope are next.

Translating is a tricky business where one can lose the feel and finer meanings very easily. I am aware of this and try to be as precise and careful as possible. In addition, there is no way for others to check the contents of the translation so I don't know what the author might think about that.

I will therefore post articles as they are finished so that I don't end up just talking about it and not doing anything.
 
Hi Rylek

It would be good if you could translate the main page on quantumfuture.net or cassiopaea.org (they are the same). That would allow a main page in Czech. After that we can just put pages up as they become available.

Joe
 
Hi Joe,

Thanks for the reply. I will post here when I have the main page translated along with other material I've been working on.
 
Hi Rylek,
I'm part of a French translation group. A network is always good to ensure a good translation, feedback is important. If you can't have a network, at least re-read your translation 2 or 3 times. If you can find someone who can read it and point the mistakes to you, that's even better; a key point is making sure that what you translate is readable and understadable, first by you and then by normally intelligent human beings. I know it sounds obvious, but apparently not not everyone.
I strongly urge you not to use translation softwares or other automatic translators, even for a draft (especially for books or long articles). It's a terrible way of translating material, a sure way to have a corrupted translation.
You'll find some more advice here : http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=5913
If you have questions or need help, don't hesitate to ask.
 
Hi Prayers,

Thank you for your suggestions, I very much appreciate it. (I have also been following the thread by Novelis about his Mandarin translations)

Concerning my network possibilities, I have been living abroad for a long time and have therefore lost most of my contacts in Czech Republic. I therefore do not have access to a network but on the other hand there is no problem to get material at least re-read for consistency and to make sure it is readable. I try to stay aware of my biases (if that is even possible) when translating and try to be as precise as possible. But as you say there's nothing like having a network. I am very meticulous and re-read my translations several times, get away from it for a while and re-read it again. In my opinion that helps to get as close to the original as subjectively possible.

As to the actual translations, I have been actively translating articles from English for various websites for the last two years. I do not use any translation software. As you rightly say, it just corrupts the text as well as robs you of the opportunity to learn more from the translated text. Translating for me is a natural culmination of my learning process as it gets the material out there as well as enable me to grasp more deeply what I am studying.

On my blog I am focusing on psychopathy at the moment and have made a short translation of Laura's 'To bee or not to be' article.

With SOTT/Cass material, I want to start from the beginning (as I am translating alone and it will therefore take some time to build up material) and psychopathy seems to me a good start.

As I have not been a member of the forum for a long time I've felt a bit uncertain about the fact that a new member translating SOTT/Cass material and what the authors might think. I would welcome any input on that. I have a question about the arrangement of putting the translated material online. Do you send translations to SOTT and they put it up or is there some other way? I know that is getting ahead of myself but I should soon be done with the front page as well as few pages of the psychopathy work done by QFS.

Thanks again
 
I've been following the discussion about translating on this thread http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=5913

Prayers for rain said:
Hello bas groepzuid!
Maybe you could introduce yourself first and tell us what material from the sites you've already read, what you understood from them, which ones you liked/disliked and why.
Ponerology is a very difficult and complex concept. My advice woud be that if you want to translate stuff from these sites, it would be good to start first by news articles from SotT's page, like the "SotT focus" for example, and stick with it for a while before turning to more complex stuff such as the Wave series and the Cass material overall.
It seems to me a good idea to also start with SOTT articles first and work my way up to more complex topics. Even though I have been studying the Cass/SOTT material for more than a year (which is not a long time) I want to make sure I get a good grasp of the topics first. That includes discussing more on the forum.
 
just a short update. I am working on the translations, especially of the main page, but things are going slow at the moment as it is essay and exam time at Uni, which does not leave me much time with all my jobs and such. But eventually I'll get there. Also, I want to make sure the translations are of a good quality.
 
Since my last post on this thread, I've come to realize a few things. The next rather lengthy quote will hopefully help with what I am trying to convey.

From Adventures with Cassiopaea (http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/adventures092.htm):

Gurdjieff said:
You will see that in life you get back exactly what you put in. Your life is the mirror of what you are, it is your image. You are passive, blind, demanding. You take all, you accept all, without ever feeling indebted. Your attitude towards the world and towards life is the attitude of one who has the right to demand and take. Of one who doesn't need to pay or gain. You believe that all things are due to you, only because it's you! All your blindness is there. It doesn't catch your attention. It is however what, in you, separates a world from another.

You have no measure to measure yourself up. You live only between 'I like it' and 'I don't like it'. Which means that you have appreciation only for yourself. You do not allow for anything above you - theoretically or logically maybe, but not in reality. This is why you are demanding and keep on thinking that everything should be cheap, and you can afford to pay for anything you want. You don't recognize anything above yourself, or
outside yourself or inside yourself. This is why, I repeat, you have no measure and live only to satisfy your whims.

Yes, your 'self appreciation' makes you blind! It is the biggest obstacle to a new life. One has to be able to pass this obstacle, this threshold, before one can go further. It is the test that separates the 'chaff' from the 'wheat' in people. No matter how intelligent, how endowed, how brilliant a man is, if he doesn't change his opinion about himself, he will be lost for inner development, for the work based on self-knowledge, for a real evolution. He will stay as he is all his life. The first demand, the first condition, the first test for he who wants to work on himself is to change his appreciation of himself. He cannot just imagine, or simply believe or think, but actually *see* things in himself that he did not see before, really see them. Never will his opinion about himself change as long as he will not see inside himself. And in order to see, he has to learn to see: it is the first initiation of man into self-knowledge.

Before anything else, he has to know what to look for. Once he knows it, he has to make efforts, focus his attention, look constantly, with tenacity. By maintaining his attention on it, by not forgetting about looking, one day he may see. If he sees once, he can see a second time, and if this is repeated he cannot ignore seeing. This is the state to look for in our observation; it is from this that the true desire, the desire to evolve, will be born; from cold we're becoming hot, vibrating; we will be deeply touched by our reality.

Today we have only the illusion of what we are. We overestimate ourselves. We do not respect ourselves. To respect myself, I have to have recognized in me a part which is higher than the other parts, and to which I show respect by the attitude I have towards it. In this way I will respect myself. And my relationships with others will be ruled by the same respect.

We have to understand that all other measuring units, talent, erudition, culture, genius, are changing units, units of detail. The only true measure, never changing, objective, the only real one, it is the measure of inner vision. 'I' see - 'I' see myself - and you have measured. With a higher, real part, you have measured a lower one, also real. And this measure, defining by itself the respective roles of each part, will bring you to self-respect. But you will see it is not easy. And it is not a bargain. One has to pay a lot. For the bad payers, the lazy, the losers, no chance. One must pay, pay a lot, pay immediately and pay in advance. Pay from oneself. With sincere efforts, wholeheartedly, without expectations.

The more you will be willing to pay without reticence, without cheating, without falsity, the more you will receive. And from then on, you will meet your true nature. And you will see all the tricks, all the dishonesty it goes to in order to avoid paying cash. Because you have to pay with all the gratuitous theories, all the deeply rooted convictions, all the prejudice, all conventions, all 'I like it' and 'I don't like it'. Without bargaining, honestly, not just make believe. Trying to see while using fake money.

Try for a moment to accept the idea that you are not what you think you are, that you overestimate yourself, therefore that you lie to yourself. That you lie to yourself always, every moment, all day long, your whole life. That the lie rules you to the extent that you cannot control it anymore. You are its victim. You lie everywhere. Your relationships with others, lies. The education you' re giving, your petty conventions, lies. our learning, lies. Your theories, your art, lies. Your social life, your family life, all lies. And what you think of yourself, lies too.

But you don't stop from what you're doing or from what you're saying, because you believe in you. You have to stop inside and observe. Observe without prejudice. While accepting for a time this idea of lies. And if you observe in this manner, paying of yourself, without self-pity, by giving all your false riches for one moment of reality, maybe someday you'll see all of a sudden something you have never saw in you before. You will see you are someone else from what you thought you are. You will see that you are two. One that is not, but takes the place and play the other's role. And the one that is, but so weak, so inconsistent, that just brought forth it disappears immediately. It cannot stand the lies. The smallest lie kills it. It doesn't fight, it does not resist, it is vanquished in advance.

Learn to look until you have observed the difference between your two natures, until you have seen the lies, the impostor in you. When you will see your two natures, that day, in you, the truth will be born. [Intro to a meeting from September, 1941: Premiere Initiation, par G.I. Gurdjieff Question de Gurdjieff (no 50) ed. Albin Michel, 1989, p.34-35]
My intentions with wanting (not doing but just wanting to) translate Cass and SOTT material was to a) deepen my understanding of the material and b) to make this material accessible to people who do not speak English. In the second case, I thought along the lines: "I want to change people by giving them access to this valuable info." I do not believe that that is a proper attitude.

For the past few months, I have been translating bits and pieces for my blogs (Twenty-Five Ways To Suppress Truth, translation of the Pentagon and Pathocracy flashes, a bit from Laura's Cosmic COINTELPRO, few entries from CASS glossary, and some of the QFS psychopathy material). In my opinion I have done something but not nearly enough.

What is enough? Enough would be to translate Laura's complete article. I have not even tried yet.

Also, there are a few things that I am not yet "comfortable" with. As of now, I do not feel confident to make "official translations". I don't think the quality would be good enough. I need to learn more about translating, improve grammar and sentence structure. I am thinking out loud here.

There are so many things I need to work on. Network more on the forum is high on the list. But to network one has to have something to network with.

So simply, I am not at the point where I can do this translation project in order for it to be consistent both in quality and output. Simple as that.

For the time being, I will continue with my blog entries until I get to the point when there is enough material and I have improved my translating skills.

So much reading to be done. As always comments are much appreciated.

[EDIT: Didn't paste the quote correctly]
 
Hi Rylek,

I think these realizations are important and a strong sign that you will, in fact, be able to translate completely at some point, and that, very likely, the work you've already done is translated in a manner true to the original work, with as little 'ego' tampering as possible. What I mean by that is that many people have come through here and started their own sites in their own languages only to, ultimately, promote themselves and their own subjective, thus flawed, understanding of the material.

None of those who have taken this route, to it's inevitable conclusion, have presented such realizations about themselves and how things 'go'. So, this seems like a good sign, to me at least.

rylek said:
There are so many things I need to work on. Network more on the forum is high on the list. But to network one has to have something to network with.
It seems to me that in order to network, all one really needs is to be sincere in their desire, their drive, to learn. If we all had to have something to immediately give back in order to network, I don't think any of us would be here. Just some thoughts.
 
Hi Anart,

thank you for your thoughts. Reading through them a few things come to mind.

First, I would like to expand on my comments about networking as how it relates to the topic of me translating.

Coming here and saying that I will translate was like making a promise. Realizing you're not able to do it is like breaking your promise. Not just towards others but yourself as well. So that's why it's also hard to admit that you just don't have what it takes.

Another issue is that ever since coming up with the idea and voicing it here on the forum, the initial thought in all of this was that 'I have to do something!'. And that's another problem. Just one of my many Is speaking there. And as one starts to realize that nothing can be done until we start to really work with ourselves, until then all effort is futile.

[Edit: My first post on the Forum, talk about coming in with a 'thud' and full of self-importance:

rylek said:
... I am new to the forum but have been around SOTT and Cassiopaea for almost a year now – an encounter which changed my life.

I have recently started a blog in Czech where I link to SOTT and the Ponerology blog.

I would like to borrow heavily from both the SOTT and Cassiopaea sites and have been therefore wondering if there is a ‘policy’ when using, or in my case translating, material from the websites apart from the obvious of linking to quotes and ideas?

In addition, I have been pondering about the possibility of doing translations of SOTT into Czech. I have experience from a previous website (where I translated mainly topics about politics and history) but I realize I am new here .... Also being a university student with two jobs does not leave me as much time as I would like to dedicate to the work.
Well, it took me some time to realize that it´s not as simple as that. That I haven´t even begun properly the necessary work on myself, such as beginning with Gurdjieff, Mouravieff etc. and then coming back and discussing.]

OzRich wrote:
http://www.cassiopaea.org/forum/index.php?topic=6954.msg48759#msg48759
OzRich said:
... I'm humbled by the vast knowledge of some of you guys, and overwhelmed by the material. ...
When I post something on the forum I try for my post to be of a similar "quality" as is the "standard" on this forum. By this I am not saying that I try to make myself into, or present myself, as something I am not but trying to find a balance between not generating noise, knowing your weaknesses but at the same time not just 'watching from the sidelines'. Not being a native English speaker is also part of it.

I guess in my case seeing individuals who come here and generate noise, I just don't want to add to that, don't want to be like that. But then that may result in the other extreme of not networking too much because one is constantly conscious about the quality of their post. I guess that is an issue for me.

anart said:
the work you've already done is translated in a manner true to the original work, with as little 'ego' tampering as possible
Event though I try to be as precise as possible when translating, I realized that without a) the benefit of a network to go through the translated text to weed out both 'ego' tampering along with translation errors, and b) having a reasonable grasp of the material, and c) knowing the machine that we are to a good extent, until then it is better to not do 'anything'. Also, I've been living abroad for quite a long time now so I lose contact with my native language. Other considerations are age, as I'm only 20+.

[Edit: Ok, I am maybe pouring my hear out and maybe this is not the best place for it but I just wanted to mention what I´ve been thinking about and that maybe my introduction here was a bit hasty looking at it from a distance.]
 
Back
Top Bottom