About David Icke & James Redfield

Argonaut

Jedi Master
Laura,

I apologize if these topics have been addressed elsewhere in the forums or the site, but I've been unable to find them. I have also not read any of your books except The Secret History of the World. So please bear with me if you've already covered these issues someplace else.

First off, where do you stand regarding David Icke and his work? I find it odd that you don't seem to mention him, nor does he ever mention you, seeing as your respective concepts and philosophies seem to mesh in so many areas. Personally, I'd think you and David would've gotten together in some form by now; maybe comparing notes and teaming up to produce some very interesting books. At any rate, SOME sort of "meeting of the minds" between you seems like a no-brainer, in my opinion. Yet you barely acknowlege him, and he utterly fails to acknowlege you, as far as I can tell. I did manage to find a miniscule mention of his "reptilians-disguised-as-world-leaders" idea (which seems to be supported by eyewitness accounts, the Emerald Tablets of Thoth, and African Zulu Sansui Credo Mutwa) in The Secret History of the World, but you just dismiss it. Which confuses me, as it seems to me that your concept of 4th-dimensional STS reptilian entities working through organic portals is basically the same idea. Or am I just not grasping the difference?

Anyway, all of this makes me wonder - is there some sort of "feud" between you and David Icke? The two of you seem to be the most prominant, objective, level-headed researchers in this area, so why not get together in some form? Or if you have issues with Icke and his ideas, why not write an article discussing why? I'm sure both of you have many shared fans, like myself, who would love to see you collaborate with him, or at least compare and contrast his concepts with your own. I do notice that Icke seems a lot more enamored with the reptilian "royal bloodlines" concept than you are. He also focuses a lot on the white Aryans originating on Mars, and being of special genetic importance to the reptilians - and I noticed you mentioning that the Aryan thing is somewhat of a disinformational "red herring". Also, he tends to focus heavily on reptilian involvement in "Satanic" rituals and child sacrifice (He often points out that they seem to have an obsession with symbolism and ritual in general), as well as blood drinking to maintain their 3rd-dimensional human "disguises". So is all of this part of your issue with him? In any case, Icke claims to eschew all agendas and simply go where the evidence leads, just as you do. So I bet that even if you feel he's dead wrong in some areas, he'd correct the problems in an instant if one were to show him exactly where and how he's wrong.

As an addendum to the David Icke question, what do you think of his most ballyhooed individuals, Credo Mutwa and Arizona Wilder? Or of his other favorite mention, Cathy O'Brien? Are any of them disinformation artists, as many people claim, or do you think there's something to their testimonies?

My second question is regarding a comment made by the C's, referenced in TSHOTW, that the "Followers of Horus" were "Those who held the 3rd 'insight'", which they claimed is the 3rd of 10 total insights. This reminds me of the 10 insights of James Redfield's Celestine Prophecy series. Do you feel there is a connection, or is this mere coincidence (or maybe a "meaningful coincidence"/"synchronicity", as Redfield might claim)?

Thanks for your time, and keep on defending the Truth!

Blessings,

Jason
 
Try using the forum search function for "david icke" and read all the threads that come up. You might be surprised.
 
Before writing that post, I looked and looked for a "Search" link for the forums, blindly assuming that the "Search" link at the top of the page was for searching the actual Web site, which I'd already tried. But I was wrong. I'll definitely read the Icke-related posts now that I know how to find them. I apologize for wasting your time. Still, any thoughts on the Celestine Prophecy "insights" question? :)
 
I've always liked Icke-there is something truly poetically apt about representing the English royals as shapeshifting reptiles even if it isn't strictly speaking factual- though I find a lot of what he has to say sheer nonsense. But at least he brings some legitimate knowledge to folk who might not otherwise have any framework to understand what is going on. But that disnfo factor......:/
Anyway here's an article i found a couple of nights ago online which may explain what's happened.
One question re Wilder et al would have to be "Well, now that you "escaped" the Illuminati and reformed, as you say, why haven't you turned yourself in to the proper authorities and confessed to assisting in the murder of innocents?"
I've read Redfield and had the strange impression there's a bunch of New Age authors who get together in a cabin in the woods, have a few brewskis and chuckle as they turn out a new best seller.
David Icke, Arizona Wilder and the Biggest Secret
------------------------------------------------------------------------
David Icke, Arizona Wilder and the Biggest Secret
By Ivan Fraser

The following is a short summary of a minor investigation into aspects of David Icke's latest book and his star witnesses Arizona Wilder and Credo Mutwa. Wilder claims to have been a mind controlled slave who performed Satanic rituals for the Illuminati at which she witnessed many famous people including the Queen Mother, shapeshift physically from a human to a lizard and consume sacrificial victims. She claims that since her programming broke down she has been able to reveal this information to the wider public.

My own role in the Biggest Secret saga was that I was asked by David to help him check spelling and offer any further information to his initial draft of the book. It was following my input that David was introduced to Arizona and heard her revelations, which subsequently became a focal point within the book and used as 'evidence' to support various themes outlined therein.

Having discussed my concerns with David's wife and having sent David e-mails outlining my concerns over errors in his book and a feeling I have that he has been set up with misinformation and been the target of psychic manipulation, over a period from before publication to very recently (September 1999), and as yet having absolutely no feedback from David about any of the major concerns, I decided to publish my findings at the David Icke website forum.

Consequently, I was banned from attending that forum by David Icke.

I wish it to be known that I bear David Icke no malice over this affair and the reason for publishing this information is to seek clarification and also offer information of which most may not be aware. My fears may be unfounded, but I feel that after reading this, you may see they are justified. And if my fears have solid foundation, these issues need urgent clarification, both for the sake of David Icke and his readers.

My suspicions about Arizona Wilder (AW) first manifested the first time I heard of her. Something in me said, 'something isn't right here'. A familiar feeling which usually turns out to be trustworthy, as anyone who has read Lifting The Veil knows.

She was not mentioned at all in the draft copy of The Biggest Secret (TBS) which I had read. David had not met her yet. When the book was released people started ringing me with questions like, 'is it true about the reptiles', and 'is this stuff about the royal family true'. At which time I replied that I thought it was, based on the fact that the version I had read stated only the theory of the reptilians and that certain of the Royals were involved in Satanic rituals.

Soon I heard about Arizona Wilder. I reviewed the book again, this time the printed version, and asked Linda Icke (the British manager of Bridge of Love) to send a copy of the video from which AW's testimony was taken. I was by this time very dubious about AW's statements. Her statements had already overshadowed those of Christine Fitzgerald, Princess Diana's healer and confidante, which were prominent in the version I read and which were not so sensational. However, Fitzgerald's account may have been a 'taster' for what was to come, to ease the way for the far more incredible information which Wilder had to impart.

David stated that he saw his encounter with AW as an amazing synchronicity which endorsed his work in his latest book. How could she have known all of this stuff which tallied so exactly with TBS? Well, I believe I am not as na
 
reptilian question

I may be incorrect, but from what I've understood through reading the message board is that there are reptilian creatures that brought us into physicality so they could eat us (more or less).

If this is the case, I'm just curious to hear some opinions on why it's a bad thing that there are fourth density reptilians eat us. It would seem to me that they probably put a lot of work into creating this illusion for us. It might not be fair, and it might stink that humans are not at the top of the food chain, but how is what they do any different than us eating animals? and that's not to say that if there is away to get out of this situation that one shouldn't take it. But I don't nessecerly see it as a bad thing.
 
reptilian question

Can I suggest the following: http:(2slash)www(dot)davidicke.com/component/option,com_contact/Itemid,3/

You might find what you are after.
 
reptilian question

If you're really interested in Reptilians, I suggest you check out the six-hour long interview Icke had with Zulu Shaman Credo Mutwa: http:(2slsh)video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6842790718258500975&q=David+Icke
 
reptilian question

They didn't create us, they merely created what you see before you, pointless but enjoyable (In our current state) detail. We, as a species, existed long before their arrival, but we were different, and I don't just mean we had more hair on our nuts. For one, there wasn't such a thing as male and female, we were both genders, 46 and 2. Our senses were heightened and primal, and relied mostly on natural instinct. We as humans could communicate with each other and other species through telepathy, Dr Doolittle without the chitter chatter and Eddie Murphy. We were all one race, and we understood the laws of nature because we formed part of them.

Basic Law of Nature:

* Don't kill something unless you're hungry or it wants to kill you (I watched 'The Jungle Book' =D)

Discrimination and senseless violence didn't form part of our reasoning, because there was no such thing as reason. When it comes down to it, reason is over romantisized speculation, that's all we do as Sentient Beings, speculate, trial and error, and error unfortunatly tends to shine more.

When the Lizards interbreeded with us, they gave us Sentience, i.e they gave us reason, i.e they gave us error. Hello Snake Devil Guy and Adam's apple.

Ever heard the old saying "Incomplete Knowledge is far more evil than Complete Ignorance", same goes for Sentience. They gave us enough to speculate but not enough to realize.

Of course, this is all speculation in of itself, I'm fascinated with Lizard people folklore and I'm a total David Icke fanboy. If it's truth or not, I have no idea. I'm rather reluctant to act on it until I know for certain.
 
reptilian question

CitizenNot said:
I'm fascinated with Lizard people folklore and I'm a total David Icke fanboy. If it's truth or not, I have no idea. I'm rather reluctant to act on it until I know for certain.
So does this mean that you're not so interested in finding the truth, as just being a "fanboy" of people like David Icke and his entirely unhelpful claims about "Lizards"? In my opinion, Icke is a little too enamoured of "Lizards", he protests about them but protests a little too much. Too much focusing on "lizards" and the like and you end up as their spokesman, like Whitley Streiber.

Joe
 
reptilian question

So does this mean that you're not so interested in finding the truth, as just being a "fanboy" of people like David Icke and his entirely unhelpful claims about "Lizards"? In my opinion, Icke is a little too enamoured of "Lizards", he protests about them but protests a little too much. Too much focusing on "lizards" and the like and you end up as their spokesman, like Whitley Streiber.
I find nothing wrong with me being interested in the writings of David Icke, in my opinion they may hold a deeper meaning. I merely said that I'm reluctant to act on them until I know for certain that they are the truth. I don't call that behaviour sedetary or whatever you were implying, I call it not being a jack ass. I do not focus on Lizards, I'm open to everything, I'm even open to the chance of everything I know and read being a crock.

I was merely responding to the creator of this thread by giving him the details of the Lizard people background as told by Credo Mutwa and David Icke.

I don't consider knowing about it or being a fan of David Icke a crime, do you?
 
reptilian question

CitizenNot said:
I find nothing wrong with me being interested in the writings of David Icke, in my opinion they may hold a deeper meaning.
But is that the same as:
CitizenNot said:
and I'm a total David Icke fanboy
Fanboy: "Fanboy or Fanboi is a term used to describe someone who is utterly devoted to a single subject or hobby, often to the point where it is considered an obsession." -wikipedia

CitizenNot said:
I merely said that I'm reluctant to act on them until I know for certain that they are the truth.
And again you contradict yourself:
CitizenNot said:
When the Lizards interbreeded with us, they gave us Sentience
You just acted on them, you stated that as some sort of fact!
 
reptilian question

There are many threads on David Icke that can be found on this forum. I have not read any of his books so I can't comment but I have read the threads and the possibility that he is a conscious COINTELPRO agent whose work has a high noise to signal ratio seems probable.

Laura wrote: David Icke has done more damage to the possibility of any real scientific exploration of the subject of UFOs and aliens being undertaken than any other single living human being. If he can't see that, then he is stupid (not ignorant, certainly). And because I don't think he is stupid, I think he is also aware of what he has done PR wise. Thus, he must be a CONSCIOUS agent of COINTELPRO.

I'm not sure why you would want to be a fan of such a person.
 
reptilian question

ScioAgapeOmnis said:
CitizenNot said:
I find nothing wrong with me being interested in the writings of David Icke, in my opinion they may hold a deeper meaning.
But is that the same as:
CitizenNot said:
and I'm a total David Icke fanboy
Fanboy: "Fanboy or Fanboi is a term used to describe someone who is utterly devoted to a single subject or hobby, often to the point where it is considered an obsession." -wikipedia

CitizenNot said:
I merely said that I'm reluctant to act on them until I know for certain that they are the truth.
And again you contradict yourself:
CitizenNot said:
When the Lizards interbreeded with us, they gave us Sentience
You just acted on them, you stated that as some sort of fact!
You do realize just how petty that is.

I am not obsessed with David Icke.

And if I stated them as fact, explain my conclusion

And I quote

CitizenNot said:
Of course, this is all speculation in of itself, I'm fascinated with Lizard people folklore and I'm a total David Icke fanboy. If it's truth or not, I have no idea. I'm rather reluctant to act on it until I know for certain.
EDIT:

I'm not sure why you would want to be a fan of such a person.
David Icke is one of the premiere Conspiracy Theorists on the planet, not to mention one of the most active. He is not JUST about Lizards, he has provided well studied and documented lectures on a variety of subjects, including the Bohemian Grove and 9/11.
 
reptilian question

ScioAgapeOmnis, instead of trying to dissect CitizenNot's posts, why don't you respond to the topic at hand?
 
reptilian question

CitizenNot said:
You do realize just how petty that is.
Actually, I don't think that 'petty' is correct in this case - ScioAgapeOmnis is merely pointing out that your post is contradictory - it is really important to not only be clear on this forum, but, whenever possible, to try to minimize the noise in what you're saying.
 
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